push it to the limit Linn kick

[groundbass]

Ha - great taste! Interesting question.

I love that 80's rhythmic drive - sounds more like 1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2, and for me more fun than 1,1,1,1,......
Anyhow I think the kick may be playing all the way through. The best thing to do to get this feel, is have a kick all the way through, but have a compressor on at least the kick and the snare. Then - since you have a nice explosive snare, when the kick and the snare coincide on the 2, the kick ducks a little.
You will have to adjust the relative volumes and the compressor to taste, but its a nice way of getting a bit of 1,2,1,2 lilt from a 4 on the floor.

Obviously if the kick is a modern strong one, it might not move much for a weak snare - depends on the weight of each - and it is actually quite hard to tell on that track since linn kicks are quite weak and sometimes easily overpowered in a mix. This can happen without compression of course, but a compressor stops things becoming lumpy.

[bil_g]

Listening on my laptop, it sounds like it is under the snare on 2 and 4. I'm pretty sure I can hear that beater.

On an Hoff-related note:
Just watched "Starcrash"(with the sound off)....can't see the Hoff these days without being reminded of you.

[Scribbler]

Hey,

I couldn't tell just listening on Youtube and I haven't got the OST to listen properly (shameful really!). Have you tried listening to it through a low pass filter? You should be able to tell if there's a kick on every beat that way.

[Ged]

hmm this is driving me nuts, it could be just the sub from the JP8 cause it's doing 8th notes so it's filling the "gap"

[javd007]

Maybe I'll take a crack at this one. I can recreate it

[bil_g]

After listening on a better system and putting my ear on the sub I am 99.9% sure it's there on all four. I think I'm hearing a ghosted 1/8th kick every once in a while as well but I'm less sure of that.

[spaceacademy]

I will take a heavy bet that its on on all four. This sort of vanishing of the kik on the 2 and the 4 happens with my Sequential sixtracks. Unless I layer a kik or get really surgical with the EQ I tend not to hear it on to 2 and 4 once the mix is going, and getting really surgical on either of them does seems to spoil their character to much. SO, what I do (strangely enough) is beef up the snare bottom end a bit more. Make the bottom end frequency match that of the snare. You dont have to be exact, best to use ears for this one. And this seems to more effective than trying to beef up the kik. You can hear this sort of thing going on in Justice Cross album but sometimes they just used the 1 and 2 and beefed up the snare to give the illusion there was a kik underneath the 3 and 4.

[musicman09]

I was wondering the same thing for ages. Its definitely kick on 1,2,3,4 with snare on 2, 4.

Since Moroder used a LM2, the LM2 snare by itself even with compression and eq does not sound as thick as in the song. Its definitely the kick underneath.

I did a quick test using LM2 kick and snare. First with kick on 1,2,3,4, then on 1, 3. Both kick and snare are compressed.

https://www.box.com/s/720fc8621ddb84cdec10

I'm sure if you layered just the snares with their own specific kick underneath tweaked you would get a good result. I'm not sure how Moroder did it back in the day.

I was confused on this too by listening to many Moroder and Faltermeyer tracks. Even on some Faltermeyer tracks, its very hard to figure out whether there is a kick underneath the snare (probably because the Beverly Hills Cop tracks im listening are from vinyl rips, and are not even available on cd, so that makes it even harder).

[Ged]

Originally Posted by musicman09

I was wondering the same thing for ages. Its definitely kick on 1,2,3,4 with snare on 2, 4.

Since Moroder used a LM2, the LM2 snare by itself even with compression and eq does not sound as thick as in the song. Its definitely the kick underneath.

I was confused on this too by listening to many Moroder and Faltermeyer tracks. Even on some Faltermeyer tracks, its very hard to figure out whether there is a kick underneath the snare (probably because the Beverly Hills Cop tracks im listening are from vinyl rips, and are not even available on cd, so that makes it even harder).

I thought it was the LinnDrum??

[musicman09]

Originally Posted by Ged

I thought it was the LinnDrum??

Yes, it is. Linndrum is often reffered to as LM2 as its the second version.

The original linndrum which is LM1 is the Prince one.

The linndrum/LM2 is all over the Beverly Hills Cop, Scarface soundtracks and countless others.

[Ged]

Originally Posted by musicman09

Yes, it is. Linndrum is often reffered to as LM2 as its the second version.

The original linndrum which is LM1 is the Prince one.

The linndrum/LM2 is all over the Beverly Hills Cop, Scarface soundtracks and countless others.

ah cool, thanks for the info!

[xanax]

it's 4 on the floor...towards the end of the song the snare disappears and you can clearly hear the kick on every beat, i agree it's very hard to tell on the rest of the song.. is this due to the mix or is it inherent to the LM2? love moroders work on scarface btw..

[mikael488]

Don't forget that Arthur Barrow and Zito arranged and performed these songs. I'm not even sure that Giorgio was there in the studio when they laid down the tracks.

[Ged]

Originally Posted by xanax

it's 4 on the floor...towards the end of the song the snare disappears and you can clearly hear the kick on every beat, i agree it's very hard to tell on the rest of the song.. is this due to the mix or is it inherent to the LM2? love moroders work on scarface btw..

I can concur !

indeed it's 4 on the floor, I listened to the drums at the sitar style solo, I think the reason it's so hard to tell is due to the massive sub of the JP8 Bass, plus the fact I doubt if they sidechained bass to kick.

[mikael488]

Originally Posted by musicman09

Yes, it is. Linndrum is often reffered to as LM2 as its the second version.

The original linndrum which is LM1 is the Prince one.

The linndrum/LM2 is all over the Beverly Hills Cop, Scarface soundtracks and countless others.

Faltermeyer had both a LM-1 and a modified LM-2 (Linndrum).

[golden beers]

if anyone wants LM2 samples, check my first post on the share samples here sticky

[mike vee]

its 4/4. When you have the 4 on the floor beat with the snare on 2/4, it changes the way both sound, especially when compressed, they change into one drum instead of just the snare and kick perfectly layered on top of each other. I love this.

I usually lower the velocity just a tad of the kick under the snare too, by like 15 or 20, and I'm sure 1000s of others do the same so maybe it's done here too. Makes it harder to tell and a bit more polished than just that slamming kick on all 4.

[Headz51230]

^ I do the exact same thing while also moving the snare off the grid a.little. also layer different snare tunings as well. The result is some serious swing.

[Ged]

cracked it!!!!

[soundtrackshack]

Originally Posted by Ged

cracked it!!!!

that sounds fantastic, what you do to make snare sounds? do you do swing on snare on top of kicks?

[Ged]

Originally Posted by soundtrackshack

that sounds fantastic, what you do to make snare sounds? do you do swing on snare on top of kicks?

thanks - just a stock snare sample from linndrum- it was really just a case of leveling the kick so you could still hear its beat with the snare.
Snare had some stock Ableton reverb.

[soundtrackshack]

Originally Posted by Ged

thanks - just a stock snare sample from linndrum- it was really just a case of leveling the kick so you could still hear its beat with the snare.
Snare had some stock Ableton reverb.

cool, thanks! did you tune the snare up or down?

also, did you reuse the same kick twice on different channels? so one kick is used for 1, and 3. and then you put the same kick on another channel on 2 and 4 and lowered its volume, eq it so it fit under the snare?

is that best way to do it? or you just keep kick on 1,2,3,4 and just tune/eq snare to fit on top of kick?

which is best way?

PS Ged, what do you use for monitors? your music mixing is marvellous!

[Headz51230]

With something punchy like a linn i doubt you'd need to do any sort of adjustments with velocity/volume at all. Reverb/gate your snare on top of it and you're gtg

[Ged]

Originally Posted by soundtrackshack

cool, thanks! did you tune the snare up or down?

also, did you reuse the same kick twice on different channels? so one kick is used for 1, and 3. and then you put the same kick on another channel on 2 and 4 and lowered its volume, eq it so it fit under the snare?

is that best way to do it? or you just keep kick on 1,2,3,4 and just tune/eq snare to fit on top of kick?

which is best way?

PS Ged, what do you use for monitors? your music mixing is marvellous!

thanks - no trickery - just balanced it by ear - kick on 1234 - didn't eq the kick or the snare at all.
And you would laugh yourself to death if I told you my Monitors!!!!

[soundtrackshack]

Originally Posted by Ged

thanks - no trickery - just balanced it by ear - kick on 1234 - didn't eq the kick or the snare at all.
And you would laugh yourself to death if I told you my Monitors!!!!

dont be shy!

i have crappy behringers.

what do you use? i think your mixes sounds great.

[Ged]