Eventide DSP4000 vs Eclipse

[Optical Lens]

An eclipse is newer, and probably more powerful, but has no vsig possibilities. A DSP4000 is old, but has vsig possibilities. The question is if you're happy with the preset list of the eclipse, or if you are gonna make your own effects in the DSP4000. DSP4000 has the beautiful black hole reverb too.

So if you want higher fidelity and set and forget, get an eclipse.
If you want the freedom of designing your own unique effects, get the 4000. If it's really important, get a 7500 or an Orville, which will beat the shit out of Eclipse.

If in doubt, get both

[audiohack]

You can design your own effects with the Eclipse by choosing two different FX algorithms and then tweaking the parameters - of which there are many. But I found this to be a bit tedious from the front panel. Not terrible, just tedious. I decided I wanted a bit more immediate hands on tweaking control so I picked up a Timefactor, Modfactor and Space. I might add the Pitchfactor at some point down the road. Since getting these boxes I haven't touched the Eclipse. I thought the Eclipse sounded excellent, but it was just not as much fun to play with. I will say that I have never had a chance to work with vsig programming ... although I am not sure I am that interested in it. I'd rather be playing music and tweaking some encoders than programming. To get the most out of the bigger Eventide units, I think you need to be willing to roll up your sleeves and do some heavier lifting programming wise. But again, that is only based on what I have read. I've only ever used the Eclipse and the stomp boxes.

[Optical Lens]

VSIG programming is hard. Prepare to spend days on your first patch! And you should get a RS232 interface (COM port).

BUT you can load vsigs into it, buy vsig packs etc.
Or you could always contact Italo de Angelis :P

The question is: Do you want the flexibility or not? how important is it ?

Yeah, the stomp boxes are also worth a look. They get software upgrades constantly and patch loading is easy I've read.

[Haven]

Originally Posted by Optical Lens

VSIG programming is hard. Prepare to spend days on your first patch! And you should get a RS232 interface (COM port).

BUT you can load vsigs into it, buy vsig packs etc.
Or you could always contact Italo de Angelis :P

The question is: Do you want the flexibility or not? how important is it ?

Yeah, the stomp boxes are also worth a look. They get software upgrades constantly and patch loading is easy I've read.

Where can I buy Vsig packs? I searched and searched...

I use both a H7600 and some of the pedals. They are both great in their own way. Pedals are more playable and fast to edit, rack is way more complex and deep. Some of the presets are just pure epic win.

Eclipse was my first Eventide (although I did have the pleasure of using a H3000 in school). One thing about the Eclipse that you may find beneficial is it has built in modulators available for every patch, so there is always an envelope follower, some LFOs and ADSRs etc you can assign to anything. This is not available on the Vsig capable boxes or the pedals. On the Vsig devices you could of course just edit from Vsig and add them but its way easier on the Eclipse IMO. On the other hand I feel the Eclipse has the worst UI of the three designs, screen is too small which results in lots of paging when editing.

[Optical Lens]

Originally Posted by Haven

Where can I buy Vsig packs? I searched and searched...

Italo de Angelis

And
Eventide - DSP7000 Series

[italo de angelis]

"VSIG programming is hard. Prepare to spend days on your first patch! And you should get a RS232 interface"

I wouldn't be so strict on this. Like everything else VSIG has a learning curve.
But it's not really about learning *how* Vsig works. It's a very, very simple and crude software with easy actions.
The real knowledge is what *you* must know to create an effect!
In my work and teaching experience I have found that a couple of generations of users have never used the old style digital delay. These younger folks don't know that a delay line with an lfo is the basis for "phasing" (not the real one), comb filtering, flanging, chorusing, ADT, psycho-acoustic panning. What they actually know is that all these effects are separate entities, mostly unrelated. This comes from using sparate devices for each effect (pedals!) or from the use of different algorithms from poorly designed units with lame manuals. Do you remember how instructive were the manuals back in the '80s and '90s?
IF you know how to build a chorus, Vsig is very easy. You start building simple effects first... a modulatable delay with a 2 ch mono mixer in front of it to create its feedback path and an lfo, conected to the delay modulation input. Then you learn how to use knobs, creating parameters with names, ranges...your basic U.I.. Later on you can get into more elaborate designs, like true stereo chorus, multivoice chorus, cross-feedback chorus, mirror or phase offset modulation and so on...
You have to know what you want or you use the factory presets (hundreds of them available). Or you learn from the presets, editing them in Vsig.
Nothing can teach you so much and lead to your own creations, including new effects not existing anywhere else.



"BUT you can load vsigs into it, buy vsig packs etc.
Or you could always contact Italo de Angelis :P"

More options, indeed.




"The question is: Do you want the flexibility or not? how important is it ?"

Yes. You have to ask these questions to yourself.
When I did, long ago, I was fed up with anything out there. I had some very good units, with great algorithms and sounds, but at the end of the day I wasn't given the possibility to create my own effects structures, with interconnections between them. Some could provide some routing programming...but that was already possible using external mixers, patchbays, etc. The Mod Factory I II algorithms in the H3000 were the very early game changers. A set of modules that I could connect as I liked...using my *knowledge* acquired in the years on digital delays, reverbs, synths, etc.



"Yeah, the stomp boxes are also worth a look. They get software upgrades constantly and patch loading is easy I've read."

I much prefer to have high quality A/D conversion and keep their quantity to a minimum. What you can do in an H8000 or ORVILLE with 2 conversion is not even possible in 4 Factors..where you have poorer conversion and *8* of them.
But that's me!

[sectiond]

hi can someone tell me if the eclipse contains the amazing "circle" effect wich is present in the dsp4000 "h3000- emulation bank" ??
or maybe under another name??
thank you,
Brian.

[Optical Lens]

What is this circle effect? Do you have any sound samples?

[rolo]

fwiw, i sold my eclipse to get a dsp4000 and an original h3000.
the eclipse is more powerful, but it lacked in sound where the 3000/4000 sounded bigger and bolder... wider as well.

[italo de angelis]

Originally Posted by sectiond

hi can someone tell me if the eclipse contains the amazing "circle" effect wich is present in the dsp4000 "h3000- emulation bank" ??
or maybe under another name??
thank you,
Brian.

The 537 CIRCLES preset (#7 in Bank 18 "H3000 Emulation) is based off a number of short delays panned around you. I'm not sure if there's a factory preset that does that on Eclipse but it's very easy to achieve running one or 2 instances of the many 4 voice delays algorithms. You can then have 8 delays panning around your head...with longer delay settings than the DSP4000, if you need that.

[sectiond]

ok,thank you for the replies !! i will keep my dsp then