Phoenix "1901"/"Girlfriend" synth: Trident vs Juno vs Prophet 08...?

yeloop · 7th February 2012

Hi Guys,

I've narrowed down my search a little as far as my first step into a real analogue synth goes...

I currently have a few digital synths - Kurzweil PC3x, a Nord Stage and a Nord Wave. I've been borrowing a DSI Prophet 08 and have discovered that for analogue sounds, there's nothing like real analogue!

I've sort of narrowed down to a Korg Trident, a Roland Juno 106, or a Dave Smith Prophet 08 when it comes to buying my own analogue synth.

I am looking for a synth that will easily do the zapping synth that is heard at the beginning of Phoenix's "1901", but which will also do beautiful warm synths like the opening section of another Phoenix track, "Girlfriend" (also from the same album).

Phoenix used a Korg Trident for the record, but I'm a bit concerned that Tridents are:
- Apparently quite unreliable
- The most expensive of the three options I've listed
- Not available with MIDI, even as a retrofit

Based on that, I've started to consider a Roland Juno 106. There are some great restored versions of these on eBay for about $1000AU. From the demos I've heard (which don't really compare to playing them!), it sounds like a very warm synth! I still haven't heard it do anything as sharp and cutting as the "1901" sound I mentioned above, though. And I've also heard that even a restored one can have real reliablity issues...

My third option - the known quantity as I am borrowing one and using it at the moment - is the Dave Smith Prophet 08. The variety of sounds it can produce is great. I've had no problems getting it to make some really tight, buzzing bass and lead sounds, as well as reasonably warm pads. I'm concerned that people have mentioned reliability issues with the Prophet 08 though. And I'm also worried that I'll be missing out on some of the old-school vintage "magic" if I buy one of these rather than a real vintage synth? Is that really just a myth though...?

I would love some advice! Based on the need for something that will last and won't need constant (and in Australia, expensive) repairs, but which will also sound beautifully warm and really fat and cutting when needed, which synth should I go for?

I would love to hear from some owners to hear their thoughts on this one!

Thanks in advance!
Mike

W-W-Int · 7th February 2012

the first trident i owned was a mk1 and had already been fried by the leaky battery thing when i got it...

having said that the synth section still worked perfectly in manual mode. the only thing fried was the patch storage. all the other sections were perfect also.

the second unit i owned had a slight volume difference between the string sections and the other 2 sections. corrected that with the individual out for the string section and just applied a bit of gain on the mixer to bring the levels in line with each other. other than that no problems other than dead battery when i got it that i replaced immediately and easily. worked fine for a long time.

a juno is a good all around string/lead/bass synth. it's strong points are the chorus circuit and low plus highpass filter in serial and general reliability. it's a bit much these days for what amounts to "that sound". by that i mean you hear a juno patch and after a while they all start to sound "juno-ey". it leaves it's mark on everything it touches. a lot of people like that distinctiveness but a master chameleon synth it is the furthest from.

the p08 is a great synth. lots of features and a lot of sound potential. the price is the problem i have with it. for that money you CAN get a fully functional trident instead.

it's a bit like the juno in that it's synth section is a very simple synth. it however has 2 oscs and a much better filter and a seperate section for brass and another for strings. for a simple synth with character for the money the trident is still better than the juno and prices are starting to reflect that as people catch on as to what it can do.

so to sum up how to decide...

if you can afford the trident and want a distinctive sounding synth as an investment and instrument you won't be dissapointed.

if you can afford the trident yet want a more versatile synth gt the p08.

if you cant afford the trident get the poly-six instead. similar synth architecture minus the second osc but with a few extra mod tricks and a more versatile effect section than the trident's flanger only.
then when money allows grab a juno as a second piece.
then when you save a bit more sell the poly-six and that plus what you saved grab a trident.

yeloop · 7th February 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by W-W-Int

the first trident i owned was a mk1 and had already been fried by the leaky battery thing when i got it...

having said that the synth section still worked perfectly in manual mode. the only thing fried was the patch storage. all the other sections were perfect also.

the second unit i owned had a slight volume difference between the string sections and the other 2 sections. corrected that with the individual out for the string section and just applied a bit of gain on the mixer to bring the levels in line with each other. other than that no problems other than dead battery when i got it that i replaced immediately and easily. worked fine for a long time.

a juno is a good all around string/lead/bass synth. it's strong points are the chorus circuit and low plus highpass filter in serial and general reliability. it's a bit much these days for what amounts to "that sound". by that i mean you hear a juno patch and after a while they all start to sound "juno-ey". it leaves it's mark on everything it touches. a lot of people like that distinctiveness but a master chameleon synth it is the furthest from.

the p08 is a great synth. lots of features and a lot of sound potential. the price is the problem i have with it. for that money you CAN get a fully functional trident instead.

it's a bit like the juno in that it's synth section is a very simple synth. it however has 2 oscs and a much better filter and a seperate section for brass and another for strings. for a simple synth with character for the money the trident is still better than the juno and prices are starting to reflect that as people catch on as to what it can do.

so to sum up how to decide...

if you can afford the trident and want a distinctive sounding synth as an investment and instrument you won't be dissapointed.

if you can afford the trident yet want a more versatile synth gt the p08.

if you cant afford the trident get the poly-six instead. similar synth architecture minus the second osc but with a few extra mod tricks and a more versatile effect section than the trident's flanger only.
then when money allows grab a juno as a second piece.
then when you save a bit more sell the poly-six and that plus what you saved grab a trident.

Thanks for this advice, I really appreciate it!

Needless to say, my usual way of deciding on new instrument purchases is to spend hours playing them, because the feel and sound of a synth (or any instrument) will be different to different people.

This situation is tricky in that the used synths (Junos, and Tridents, etc) are all overseas - they very rarely pop up in Australia. So I only have the Dave Smith to try, but need advice and opinions on the others!

As this will be sitting alongside a number of other synths (albeit all digital) in my studio, it doesn't have to be a silver bullet that provides me with a massive variety of sounds. On the other hand, I'm getting the feeling that the Junos do one thing (but very well!) and not much more.

The Trident does sound like a more interesting and versatile analogue synth, from the demos I've heard online. But the ones I've seen in decent shape are more expensive than the Prophet 08 even (which is $2,200ish here in Australia) - and that starts to feel like a scary investment for something that's so old, compared to the Dave Smith which of course comes with a warranty.

I'd love some other views on this!

Cheers,
Mike

allhazardsadam · 7th February 2012

I think the synth they used the most on that album was the CS-80...but if you are overwhelmed by the Trident don't even bother.

flat earth · 7th February 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by yeloop

Phoenix used a Korg Trident for the record, but I'm a bit concerned that Tridents are:

- Apparently quite unreliable

Apart from the leaky battery (not so much of a common problem as Polysix), they are pretty well built. Mine is fine, stays in tune, doesn't take much time to warm up. Considering how many synths I've owned in the past that has had issues, the Trident is one of the few that has proved pretty solid.

Also, chances are, if a Trident is up for sale these days, its probably had the battery replaced anyway.

Quote:

- The most expensive of the three options I've listed

You do see them go under £1000 occasionally. But yes prices are going up. (ie, good investment)

Quote:

Originally Posted by yeloop

- Not available with MIDI, even as a retrofit

CHD ELEKTROSERVIS

Quote:

Originally Posted by allhazardsadam

I think the synth they used the most on that album was the CS-80...but if you are overwhelmed by the Trident don't even bother.

The Trident can do pretty good CS80 type sounds. There are times their charactor's paths cross. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Zhcyjho-Qg

RonGherkins · 10th February 2012

What else does Phoenix use synth wise. I too enjoy that sound.

synthguy · 10th February 2012

I have to say as a non-owner of any of them but familiar with all three, that the Prophet 08 is the most versatile synth in the lot. Unless you want that classic string ensemble sound from the Trident, or that classic KORG filter sound, the Prophet will give you fresh sounds forever. The Triton does offer you two decent synth sections including the Brass, and a nice analog flanger. The Juno offers a nice basic sound and a good chorus effect, but a DCO with a sub just doesn't deliver the same flexibility and soundmaking power as a two OSC synth.

7th February 2012	#1
yeloop Gear nut Joined: Jun 2010 Posts: 131 Thread Starter	Phoenix "1901"/"Girlfriend" synth: Trident vs Juno vs Prophet 08...? Hi Guys, I've narrowed down my search a little as far as my first step into a real analogue synth goes... I currently have a few digital synths - Kurzweil PC3x, a Nord Stage and a Nord Wave. I've been borrowing a DSI Prophet 08 and have discovered that for analogue sounds, there's nothing like real analogue! I've sort of narrowed down to a Korg Trident, a Roland Juno 106, or a Dave Smith Prophet 08 when it comes to buying my own analogue synth. I am looking for a synth that will easily do the zapping synth that is heard at the beginning of Phoenix's "1901", but which will also do beautiful warm synths like the opening section of another Phoenix track, "Girlfriend" (also from the same album). Phoenix used a Korg Trident for the record, but I'm a bit concerned that Tridents are: - Apparently quite unreliable - The most expensive of the three options I've listed - Not available with MIDI, even as a retrofit Based on that, I've started to consider a Roland Juno 106. There are some great restored versions of these on eBay for about $1000AU. From the demos I've heard (which don't really compare to playing them!), it sounds like a very warm synth! I still haven't heard it do anything as sharp and cutting as the "1901" sound I mentioned above, though. And I've also heard that even a restored one can have real reliablity issues... My third option - the known quantity as I am borrowing one and using it at the moment - is the Dave Smith Prophet 08. The variety of sounds it can produce is great. I've had no problems getting it to make some really tight, buzzing bass and lead sounds, as well as reasonably warm pads. I'm concerned that people have mentioned reliability issues with the Prophet 08 though. And I'm also worried that I'll be missing out on some of the old-school vintage "magic" if I buy one of these rather than a real vintage synth? Is that really just a myth though...? I would love some advice! Based on the need for something that will last and won't need constant (and in Australia, expensive) repairs, but which will also sound beautifully warm and really fat and cutting when needed, which synth should I go for? I would love to hear from some owners to hear their thoughts on this one! Thanks in advance! Mike __________________ -- Mike Pooley www.thepeopledownstairs.com Mac Pro Quad Core Cubase 6.5 RME Fireface UFX Nord Stage 2 Nord Wave Kurzweil PC361 Roland TD12 Yamaha U1 piano

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7th February 2012	#2
W-W-Int Lives for gear Joined: Dec 2008 Posts: 1,240	the first trident i owned was a mk1 and had already been fried by the leaky battery thing when i got it... having said that the synth section still worked perfectly in manual mode. the only thing fried was the patch storage. all the other sections were perfect also. the second unit i owned had a slight volume difference between the string sections and the other 2 sections. corrected that with the individual out for the string section and just applied a bit of gain on the mixer to bring the levels in line with each other. other than that no problems other than dead battery when i got it that i replaced immediately and easily. worked fine for a long time. a juno is a good all around string/lead/bass synth. it's strong points are the chorus circuit and low plus highpass filter in serial and general reliability. it's a bit much these days for what amounts to "that sound". by that i mean you hear a juno patch and after a while they all start to sound "juno-ey". it leaves it's mark on everything it touches. a lot of people like that distinctiveness but a master chameleon synth it is the furthest from. the p08 is a great synth. lots of features and a lot of sound potential. the price is the problem i have with it. for that money you CAN get a fully functional trident instead. it's a bit like the juno in that it's synth section is a very simple synth. it however has 2 oscs and a much better filter and a seperate section for brass and another for strings. for a simple synth with character for the money the trident is still better than the juno and prices are starting to reflect that as people catch on as to what it can do. so to sum up how to decide... if you can afford the trident and want a distinctive sounding synth as an investment and instrument you won't be dissapointed. if you can afford the trident yet want a more versatile synth gt the p08. if you cant afford the trident get the poly-six instead. similar synth architecture minus the second osc but with a few extra mod tricks and a more versatile effect section than the trident's flanger only. then when money allows grab a juno as a second piece. then when you save a bit more sell the poly-six and that plus what you saved grab a trident.

7th February 2012	#4
allhazardsadam Gear nut Joined: Jun 2011 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 112	I think the synth they used the most on that album was the CS-80...but if you are overwhelmed by the Trident don't even bother.

10th February 2012	#6
RonGherkins Lives for gear Joined: Dec 2010 Location: Toronto Posts: 952 3 Reviews written	What else does Phoenix use synth wise. I too enjoy that sound.

10th February 2012	#7
synthguy Gear maniac Joined: Jun 2011 Posts: 167	I have to say as a non-owner of any of them but familiar with all three, that the Prophet 08 is the most versatile synth in the lot. Unless you want that classic string ensemble sound from the Trident, or that classic KORG filter sound, the Prophet will give you fresh sounds forever. The Triton does offer you two decent synth sections including the Brass, and a nice analog flanger. The Juno offers a nice basic sound and a good chorus effect, but a DCO with a sub just doesn't deliver the same flexibility and soundmaking power as a two OSC synth.