First Synth Purchase.

[Mistur]

Hey guys!
I'm on the path to buying my first synthesiser because i am sick of these soft synths and i need something more hands on.

So i was wondering if analog synths can make any kind of sound, not only warm sounding ones! :D (as you can tell i'm new to producing, and i am not to knowledgable of synthesis.)
I'm am into stuff like this:
Distrakt Rompa Stompa [Zimo Remix] - YouTube

I'm not really sure what genre you would call it (Electro house, Concrete.... i don't know, pretty much every thing is called electro house these days.)

So yeah, i was just wondering if it is worth looking for analog synths or just sticking to digitals.
If any of you have any recommendations of a synth that i should check out then it would be much appreciated.
Thanks heaps guys!

-Cameron.

[Barfunkel]

I'm not an expert in electro house, but I feel that the genre doesn't really need analog sounds. Better to spend the money on monitoring and room treatment, if possible. Maybe some new plug ins.

[Mistur]

Thanks for the reply! Room treatment and better monitoring is not really an option right now, i am just checking out what is in store in the synth department! Anyway thank you a lot for the quick reply!

[Antoine8]

Originally Posted by Barfunkel

I'm not an expert in electro house, but I feel that the genre doesn't really need analog sounds. Better to spend the money on monitoring and room treatment, if possible. Maybe some new plug ins.

Whilst your point is good the op is asking about analog synths and not more soft synths!

So a question to the op, why do you want to steer away from soft synths, I am just curious?

Do you program your own sounds? You will most likely be doing this on analog hardware.
May I suggest for your fist bit of hardware do not do as I did and purchase the most expensive, give something like Tetra by DSI a try, about $700 or $800 US. Sorry did you mention you had a budget?
The Terta is a small version of the Prophet 8.
It is a fantastic analogue polyphonic synth.

If $800 is to expensive give the Korg Monotribe a go, small, rock solid build and a sequencer to go with it, all that with some analogue sound to go with it. Oh Did I mention it is only about $400 or so US, damn that is a steal if you ask me.
Good Luck on the hunt of your first hardware analogue purchase.
Wise choice!

[Ausgeno]

Monotribe is only $250, but budget $50 for a MIDI mod to get the most out of it. The only problem I have with the Monotribe is the clicky attack that's hard to dial out. $400 would get him a Mopho, but I'd also strongly consider the Shruthi-1 at that price range. For $800 the Tetra is awesome though. Minibrute is another great looking option for $425 but it's hard to recommend as it isn't out yet.

[Antoine8]

Originally Posted by Ausgeno

Monotribe is only $250, but budget $50 for a MIDI mod to get the most out of it. The only problem I have with the Monotribe is the clicky attack that's hard to dial out. $400 would get him a Mopho, but I'd also strongly consider the Shruthi-1 at that price range. For $800 the Tetra is awesome though. Minibrute is another great looking option for $425 but it's hard to recommend as it isn't out yet.

Agrees.
However at $250 damn that is almost the price of a soft synth, go go run and buy one.

[Praxisaxis]

the sounds in the youtube vid that you've linked to from the "drop" onwards (about 1:28) are not (normally) achievable by an analogue synth just by itself. Indeed I would be greatly surprised if that track were not mostly done "inboard," if not entirely.

However, analogue certainly doesn't just mean "warm." You can get cutting and abrasive sounds from analogue, as well as watery and organic. The difference in this case is that with additional processing you can extract extreme detail, also, you can use cut/paste and re-sampled bass so that the core sound is constantly fluctuating (ie in the video you linked to).

In short, as far as that style of music goes, analogue synths are good as a foundation, as well as exotic effects, but you're going to need to do all sorts of other stuff to get that end result. To make that sort of music, that is really where the learning curve is (also knowing how to mix well in that environment).

As someone else mentioned, you may be better off investing in some good monitors.

Don't take that advice lightly - it's probably a much more crucial concern than the whole software vs. hardware thing.

[Ausgeno]

Originally Posted by Antoine8

Agrees.
However at $250 damn that is almost the price of a soft synth, go go run and buy one.

So true. And for some reason, everything usually costs more expensive in Australia compared to the US, except oddly enough my Monotribe only cost me AUS$189 which is about US$195, and then another US$55 for Altitude909s MIDI kit, so about $250 all up for a Miditribe, amazing value.

[Mistur]

Originally Posted by Antoine8

Whilst your point is good the op is asking about analog synths and not more soft synths!

So a question to the op, why do you want to steer away from soft synths, I am just curious?

Do you program your own sounds? You will most likely be doing this on analog hardware.
May I suggest for your fist bit of hardware do not do as I did and purchase the most expensive, give something like Tetra by DSI a try, about $700 or $800 US. Sorry did you mention you had a budget?
The Terta is a small version of the Prophet 8.
It is a fantastic analogue polyphonic synth.

If $800 is to expensive give the Korg Monotribe a go, small, rock solid build and a sequencer to go with it, all that with some analogue sound to go with it. Oh Did I mention it is only about $400 or so US, damn that is a steal if you ask me.
Good Luck on the hunt of your first hardware analogue purchase.
Wise choice!

Yes i do program my own sounds and i am just moving away because i get sick of sitting infront of the computer with only the mouse! It is just not hands on enough for me! I do have a midi keyboard that has helped a lot but i just feel like i need to get away from the computer screen more often when making sounds. I will be sure to check out those synths and my budget is about $1500 max. Thankyou for the reply!

[Mistur]

Originally Posted by Praxisaxis

the sounds in the youtube vid that you've linked to from the "drop" onwards (about 1:28) are not (normally) achievable by an analogue synth just by itself. Indeed I would be greatly surprised if that track were not mostly done "inboard," if not entirely.

However, analogue certainly doesn't just mean "warm." You can get cutting and abrasive sounds from analogue, as well as watery and organic. The difference in this case is that with additional processing you can extract extreme detail, also, you can use cut/paste and re-sampled bass so that the core sound is constantly fluctuating (ie in the video you linked to).

In short, as far as that style of music goes, analogue synths are good as a foundation, as well as exotic effects, but you're going to need to do all sorts of other stuff to get that end result. To make that sort of music, that is really where the learning curve is (also knowing how to mix well in that environment).

As someone else mentioned, you may be better off investing in some good monitors.

Don't take that advice lightly - it's probably a much more crucial concern than the whole software vs. hardware thing.

Great answer man! really helpful! It is starting to sound like analogs aren't the weapon of choice for the music i like, but would something like a virus (even though they are pricey and way overused) be worth checking out as it isn't analog? I have heard that they can get some very original sounds if you stay away from the presets.

Thanks again for your replies everyone!

[Antoine8]

Originally Posted by Ausgeno

So true. And for some reason, everything usually costs more expensive in Australia compared to the US, except oddly enough my Monotribe only cost me AUS$189 which is about US$195, and then another US$55 for Altitude909s MIDI kit, so about $250 all up for a Miditribe, amazing value.

Yeah I am in Oz too, it sux down here for gear hunting. I am currently in the middle of purchasing an analog console and a whole heap of other gear.
Man it is a nightmare, really it is.
The pages on the website for example ssl, leads you to a dealer in oz who does not even know he is listed as a dealer on the company website.
Whats worse he tells you he does not even have the gear listed on the website.
Arragghhhh!

[Antoine8]

Originally Posted by Mistur

Yes i do program my own sounds and i am just moving away because i get sick of sitting infront of the computer with only the mouse! It is just not hands on enough for me! I do have a midi keyboard that has helped a lot but i just feel like i need to get away from the computer screen more often when making sounds. I will be sure to check out those synths and my budget is about $1500 max. Thankyou for the reply!

Dude I started programming on a little Moog phatty, I think you have just enough for one of them.

Moog Slim Phatty may be a way to go.

In terms of computer screen man I feel you, I am just in the middle of purchasing an analog desk, I want to avoid the computer as much as possibile also especially given that I use one 9 to 5, 5 days a week.

[Ausgeno]

Originally Posted by Mistur

I will be sure to check out those synths and my budget is about $1500 max. Thankyou for the reply!

Mmm, you could get a Macbeth Micromac for that price. Yum. Or you could buy a Minibrute, Minitaur AND a Mopho and have an awesome trio of very different sounding analog synths. Either way, something starting with 'M' would be a good start.

Originally Posted by Antoine8

Yeah I am in Oz too, it sux down here for gear hunting. I am currently in the middle of purchasing an analog console and a whole heap of other gear.
Man it is a nightmare, really it is.
The pages on the website for example ssl, leads you to a dealer in oz who does not even know he is listed as a dealer on the company website.
Whats worse he tells you he does not even have the gear listed on the website.
Arragghhhh!

Damn, that sucks man, sorry to hear it! That's the reason I end up getting a lot of my stuff from the states. I've bought some Korg stuff from analoguehaven.com in the past, I bought my Tetra while I was in NYC and I've ordered the Minibrute from Musicians Friend because they only charge $25 for international shipping. We get shafted really badly on pricing most of the time. Not the Moog stuff though for some reason. I noticed the Slim Phatty was about $800 in both Australia and the US.

[Antoine8]

Sorry dude i have a virus polar, and for the money you have you can get a virus snow.
One word, amazing in every way.

Amazing bit of kit! The snow is a beast.
Oops this brings you back to the computer screen

[Mistur]

Originally Posted by Antoine8

Yeah I am in Oz too, it sux down here for gear hunting. I am currently in the middle of purchasing an analog console and a whole heap of other gear.
Man it is a nightmare, really it is.
The pages on the website for example ssl, leads you to a dealer in oz who does not even know he is listed as a dealer on the company website.
Whats worse he tells you he does not even have the gear listed on the website.
Arragghhhh!

Hahah this is so true for pretty much anything like this!

[Mistur]

Originally Posted by Antoine8

Dude I started programming on a little Moog phatty, I think you have just enough for one of them.

Moog Slim Phatty may be a way to go.

In terms of computer screen man I feel you, I am just in the middle of purchasing an analog desk, I want to avoid the computer as much as possibile also especially given that I use one 9 to 5, 5 days a week.

Yes i was wondering about the moogs actually! I have heard that they are an amazing synth, but would they be a decent choice for they music i am interested in?
Thanks for the reply!

[Mistur]

Originally Posted by Antoine8

Sorry dude i have a virus polar, and for the money you have you can get a virus snow.
One word, amazing in every way.

Amazing bit of kit! The snow is a beast.
Oops this brings you back to the computer screen

haha i wish the polars or desktops were in my price range! Definantly look like a great synth.
Thankyou for the reply!

[KT1]

First synth - I'm assuming you have little to know experience. You want something basic = perhaps a classic subtractive synth. Learn what you want and dont want from a synth. I wouldn't spend much at this point until you understand more about synthesis and then can conclude what your requirements are. Right now your perception of warm/cold is probably not in-line with what those descriptions really sound like. Some great possible options coming soon such as the little arturia synth seen at NAMM. be patient - perhaps just start with a software equivalent.

My 2 cents

[Praxisaxis]

I have a Moog LP and a Voyager, and I really like both.

As far as "are they good for the sort of music you want to make".... well think of it this way:

An analogue synth has a sort of depth and presence that makes its tone viable all by itself - you can sit there and listen to it all day, with no processing. In my experience that's not as true of analogue emulation *

But for a lot of modern electronic music, you're not hearing that sound straight up - it's often got a tonne of processing applied, and/or been re sampled.

2 things about that: I've found analogue synths that have a very distinctive sound shine through despite what you process them with... check out the tune in my sig - that's a Little Phatty doing the bass, which I think is really impossible to disguise even after heavy processing. So if you get a meaty analogue, you will want to like the sound of it, because that's what you're stuck with no matter what you dial in. They are designed to sound a certain way.

Secondly, if you're only ever applying layers and layers of heavy processing, despite what I just said, you arguably don't need an analogue synth because the interest, in this case, is in the depth of detail from the processing. What's more, with this sort of work flow, you're inclined to sample the sound source and use parts of it - analogue might prove too unpredictable given the intricacies you're invoking. Digital has a clear advantage in this regard.

None of this factors in the musicality concern though - there's no getting around it: using panel knobs to directly affect sound parameters is inherently more musical and that is one of the attractions of analogue.

*although some hardware analogue modelling seems to hit it just right every now and then - think Nord Lead - still doesn't sound "analogue" but has its own beauty.

[Praxisaxis]

BTW for what it's worth I second either a Monotribe with a midi kit... that's a hugely capable instrument for its price point. Either that or wait for the Minibrute, which is going to smash its way into the market if I'm not mistaken (this is clearly going to be a leader if you want a keyboard, albeit a tiny one).

Other options are the Minitaur, which is restricted but from what I can tell is going to be an awesome synth, or maybe the Dark Energy.

Make sure you compare the specs.... a lot of them are in competition, but equally, they each do slightly different stuff. Eg., the Minibrute does NOT have presets or patch recall, which IMO is not a bad thing, but will rule it out for many people.

[G. Kaye]

I don't get the suggestions of investing in room treatment, plug-ins, monitors, etc. That sounds like advice you would give to an aspiring engineer, not producer/musician. Starting out as a musician/producer you should be investing in the best instruments first, then worry about recording them afterwards.

Its like that saying 'you can't polish a turd'. If you spend all your money on room treatment/monitors, and invest little in your instruments, the great room treatment/monitors are just going to show you how crappy those cheap instruments really are, not make them sound better.

I'd say if you want a hardware synth invest in an entry level analog. That new minibrute might be perfect for you. Is it going to solve all your needs? Maybe not, but it could, and if not you can still incorporate your softsynths into the mix for other sounds if needed. It would be a solid foundation to build off of as a first synth, imo.

btw, I'd stay away from the monotribe/tron, unless you have experience soldering midi connections. Otherwise its pretty much just an fx module. Get something with a keyboard, or at least has midi to connect a keyboard so you can play it. Minibrute, Dark Energy, Slim Phatty, Mopho if going the dco route, all reasonably priced new, full-fledged analog synths. cheers

[Antoine8]

Originally Posted by Mistur

Yes i was wondering about the moogs actually! I have heard that they are an amazing synth, but would they be a decent choice for they music i am interested in?
Thanks for the reply!

Of course, a moog can do anything.
I think you can program any sound in the moog, and in terms of electro and the bass which this genre is heavily bound on, yes indeed it can do what you want it to do.

Let me warn you though it takes a while to get the sound you want, do not expect to turn one on and just use a preset. These synths do not work like that, I have found analoge gear is all about passion and the willingness to get under the hood and explore.
Like most others have said analog is different and beautiful to create music with.
Picture a sound, and the moog can make it, dial in a few knobs and you have instantly changed your sound from a growling lead to a deep heavy bass without even trying. This is my experience in using analog gear, it just behaves differently to anything else I have used.

[Praxisaxis]

Originally Posted by G. Kaye

I don't get the suggestions of investing in room treatment, plug-ins, monitors, etc. That sounds like advice you would give to an aspiring engineer, not producer/musician. Starting out as a musician/producer you should be investing in the best instruments first, then worry about recording them afterwards.

Its like that saying 'you can't polish a turd'. If you spend all your money on room treatment/monitors, and invest little in your instruments, the great room treatment/monitors are just going to show you how crappy those cheap instruments really are, lol.

I'd say if you want a hardware synth invest in an entry level analog. That new minibrute might be perfect for you. Is it going to solve all your needs? Maybe not, but it could, and if not you can still incorporate your softsynths into the mix for other sounds if needed. It would be a solid foundation to build off of as a first synth, imo.

I think that's a bit one-sided. I would agree with all that, except that these days a) soft synths are pretty darn decent, and b) the sort of music he linked to requires software, generally speaking. I'm not saying he shouldn't get a synth, but I would suggest there is an argument to be made that monitors will be money better spent when considering a) and b).

The main reason I'd suggest getting a synth instead of monitors is purely for sex appeal. You'll work more with a new synth... there's no doubt there's something inherently pleasant, musical and inspiring about it.

In other words, if you want to make the practical choice, get some monitors so you can hear the music you're making properly; if you want to make the sexy choice, buy a synth so you can enjoy making the music.

[Mistur]

Thankyou for all the replies everyone! i really appreciate it!

[Antoine8]

Originally Posted by G. Kaye

I don't get the suggestions of investing in room treatment, plug-ins, monitors, etc. That sounds like advice you would give to an aspiring engineer, not producer/musician. Starting out as a musician/producer you should be investing in the best instruments first, then worry about recording them afterwards.

Its like that saying 'you can't polish a turd'. If you spend all your money on room treatment/monitors, and invest little in your instruments, the great room treatment/monitors are just going to show you how crappy those cheap instruments really are, lol.

I'd say if you want a hardware synth invest in an entry level analog. That new minibrute might be perfect for you. Is it going to solve all your needs? Maybe not, but it could, and if not you can still incorporate your softsynths into the mix for other sounds if needed. It would be a solid foundation to build off of as a first synth, imo.

Agrees 100%, the poor guy has just began a pursuit in analog gear, do not tell him he needs new monitors and room treatment. Boring, even though you are maybe right as monitors an room treatment are crucial. But this guy first needs a new hardware kit to explore the beauty of transistors and the difference between softsynths and analog hardware.
You will in time get the monitors and room treatment.

[Antoine8]

Originally Posted by Mistur

Thankyou for all the replies everyone! i really appreciate it!

Why have you not ordered the moog for delivery yet? What you are to busy thanking us, get out of here dude, visit Moog Music now.

Ha ha best of luck, laters!

[Ausgeno]

Originally Posted by G. Kaye

btw, I'd stay away from the monotribe/tron, unless you have experience soldering midi connections.

Not anymore! No solder MIDI kit for Monotribe, plug and play:


http://www.gearslutz.com/board/elect...midi-kits.html

[Mistur]

Originally Posted by Antoine8

Of course, a moog can do anything.
I think you can program any sound in the moog, and in terms of electro and the bass which this genre is heavily bound on, yes indeed it can do what you want it to do.

Let me warn you though it takes a while to get the sound you want, do not expect to turn one on and just use a preset. These synths do not work like that, I have found analoge gear is all about passion and the willingness to get under the hood and explore.
Like most others have said analog is different and beautiful to create music with.
Picture a sound, and the moog can make it, dial in a few knobs and you have instantly changed your sound from a growling lead to a deep heavy bass without even trying. This is my experience in using analog gear, it just behaves differently to anything else I have used.

This honestly sounds like you are advertising Moogs! haha but this honestly does sound very fun and versitile! definantly will keep possibly a slim phatty in mind.

[Mistur]

I am just looking for a synth to learn and have fun with and create some cool sounds right now, when i need monitors and all the other stuff i will buy it!

[G. Kaye]

Originally Posted by Ausgeno

Not true! No solder MIDI kit for Monotribe, plug and play:


http://www.gearslutz.com/board/elect...midi-kits.html

my bad, can it transmit pitch.mod wheel, and velocity?

Still seems like a lot to pay all together when you could save and just get a minibrute for a few hundred more. Monotribe seems kind of limited to. Does sound good though.

If the monotron had a plug-play midi, I'd be all over it for that price. Monotribe though, $300+ for a limited hacked synth seems a bit pricey considering all the other options right above that price range. I've heard they have trouble staying in tune too, maybe the reason Korg is avoiding adding midi, because they know you cant play it musically on a keyboard anyways if it cant stay in tune. So they just want it to be an fx thingy. Maybe getting the tuning stable would be too pricey and drive up the cost. idk though just speculating.