Promoting your music/Where to get emails of Djs ?

[Romain74]

Hi everyone !

I have a "business/networking" question here.

Everybody keep saying that if you want your tracks to be known and signed by an important label, you got to have it played by some "famous" Djs ! [simply said ..]

What's the strategie to get some mails ? I mean sometimes Djs let a "promo@email.com" (and half time they don't even read mails because there is too much) but in most case, what's the best plan ?

Maybe there is some management/promotional agency that give you a mailing service ? (with fee)

And also do you know a good way to not be "fooled" by djs/labels ? (a friend of mine has been by Axtone (Axwell's label) recently ; Can't do anything then ...)

Have a nice day !

[Radiance]

Originally Posted by Romain74

And also do you know a good way to not be "fooled" by djs/labels ? (a friend of mine has been by Axtone (Axwell's label) recently ; Can't do anything then ...)

What do you mean by "fooled"?

As for the rest, I think you should look into Soundcloud as a way to reach Dj's instead of emailing them.

[Mardi Gras]

RA: Top 1000 DJs

[Yoozer]

Thousands like you have the same problem.

Posting a comment on SC or Facebook is cheap. It's zero effort. It also drowns in the rest of the comments that do exactly the same.

If you are trying to reach a lot of people in a cheap way, it's not that different from all the other spam.

So why not pick a handful of DJs you admire and put some effort in the presentation? Perhaps even something physical. Something authentic that shows you personally care about the response? Sure - your success may still not be guaranteed. But at least you will stand out from everyone else who did not put in any effort at all, treating every DJ as an interchangeable entity.

[AJ Reynolds]

try and talk to DJ's in a club, when they not playing obviously. if your interesting enough and you turn up at enough of their gigs you might get invited back to someones house for an after party. then you might get a chance to play your tracks to them and whoever else is in the room.

befriending whoever runs the parties works too.

[thomas_lang]

Always send a personal email, as opposed to a mass mailout. This works for both, producer/label mails. The amount of mails we used to get at the label I worked at were so obviously spam we'd just ignore them. If you do go for the mass mail I suggest not to cc everyone in! Soundcloud now is great, I always contact people directly and personalize it, even if it's something as simple as 'loved the last release, wondering can I send you some tracks' etc..

[thomas_lang]

As for being fooled by labels, read the contract and have someone check it over. Most labels are pretty fair with licensing, however an advance may not always be as much as you hoped - especially with smaller/digital labels.

[Reptil]

right. first you have to have a product. a number of good tracks. put that on a CD, if you think your stuff is really really good, make sure your copyright is secured (is automatically yours but register as the orginal creator), then send a label the CD to check out. if they say yes, before that, read up on contracts etc. - do a search on Gearslutz. make sure you have some legal grounding and then work with the people you want to work with. just be good enough, and they'll come, no problem.

the old way is just walk up to a dj and give them some dubplate record you had pressed. phonenumber and name on the record not just the sleeve. LOL

instead of just having some other dj play it why not try to organise a nice live gig for yourself? no matter if you start small. team up with some people and throw some parties/concerts or something like that. more credit, more fans.

can we hear it? or part of it?

[Oh...]

Originally Posted by Reptil

right. first you have to have a product. a number of good tracks. put that on a CD, if you think your stuff is really really good, make sure your copyright is secured (is automatically yours but register as the orginal creator), then send a label the CD to check out. if they say yes, before that, read up on contracts etc. - do a search on Gearslutz. make sure you have some legal grounding and then work with the people you want to work with. just be good enough, and they'll come, no problem.

the old way is just walk up to a dj and give them some dubplate record you had pressed. phonenumber and name on the record not just the sleeve. LOL

instead of just having some other dj play it why not try to organise a nice live gig for yourself? no matter if you start small. team up with some people and throw some parties/concerts or something like that. more credit, more fans.

can we hear it? or part of it?

Pretty good advice really

[thefunnel]

I make connections with the people I respect. I do not send spammy mass promo e-mails. I selectively choose the people who get them, by first building a relationship with those individuals. I don't copy/paste or CC/BCC. It's more time consuming, but I know I'd rather receive a unique and personal message from someone trying to promote their music, so I do the same. The more you get involved, the more connections you make. I try to keep it as natural as possible.

Maybe it's bad for business, but I have a list of about 20 DJs (and a couple agents) tops that I send promos to. The key being that only a few are what I'd consider "small players" (not a knock, I am too), and the rest will actually make an impact if they like/play/chart my records. I am not in the business of giving away music for free (well, sometimes), and have a real investment in the music I release (time and money), so I can't afford to use a promo list of hundreds of individuals that could potentially cannibalize sales.

So far, it's worked out pretty well for me. Even as a small timer, I still get a lot of shit/spammy promos, and tend to not really care. Getting that personal e-mail makes me light up.

EDIT: also, another important part of the selective approach is that it forces you to think about what you're sending to whom...by that I mean you're not gonna send dubstep tracks to Richie Hawtin, or deep house to Paul Oakenfold. You need to consider your audience...I'm a producer who dabbles in a few styles, although most of my focus is in the house/techno realm. But even then, if I'm making more traditional house, I'm not gonna send promos to a major electro house DJ unless I really thought it would appeal to them. And it's worth knowing a DJ's style, because by listening to their mixes and/or productions, you may find that they actually have a wider range of taste than initially thought.

[thefunnel]

Originally Posted by LaLa

do djs really read promo emails from artists?

i'm always reading that they delete all this stuff because it's too much/too bad and all are prasing their promos as the next big club banger

are there other ways to reach the djs? dj-promo-pools? blogs?

Yeah, they/we do read them, but I can tell in 5 seconds, and oftentimes by just the subject line if its hyped BS spam, or a real e-mail.

I don't mind receiving a ZIP/RAR package that has an info TXT with all the usual marketing PR--it's basically a requirement when you're releasing music. But I don't want it in the body of the e-mail, surrounded by placeholder graphics and impersonal hype. Talk to ME, don't talk to everybody.



AND ONE MORE THING: If you're a label owner or a producer using a feedback-based promo service, DO NOT GET PISSY AND EMOTIONAL IF I GIVE AN HONEST AND CRITICAL REVIEW/FEEDBACK OF YOUR TRACK/RELEASE. It's only happened once before, but I gave a couple "negative" reviews to two releases from a smaller label that had me on their promo list, thinking I was doing the right thing by filling out their FEEDBACK FORM that was required before downloading the music. Instead of following up with questions or appreciation, they kicked me off their promo list and said some things to an acquaintance that made it back to me. Now I REALLY don't support these asswipes. No loss, the music was pretty pedestrian, hence the criticism I gave. But shit, isn't that the whole point? Wouldn't you rather have an honest (and private!) review, rather than some run-of-the-mill "SOLID WILL TRY" or "Marco's agent here, downloaded for him."

[mindseye]

Originally Posted by thomas_lang

As for being fooled by labels, read the contract and have someone check it over. Most labels are pretty fair with licensing, however an advance may not always be as much as you hoped - especially with smaller/digital labels.

As far as licensing, how exactly does that work when dealing with a small/digital label, in a general sense? thanks

[thefunnel]

Originally Posted by mindseye

As far as licensing, how exactly does that work when dealing with a small/digital label, in a general sense? thanks

Just read that shit over, it may be in semi-lawyer speak, but it's usually pretty cut and dry. It can be variable. And advice I received from a big player that makes his living off this is: if the option is no contract or a super restrictive one, choose no contract. Rights are in your favor as the artist rather than the label, so if the track gets big or gets licensed out to others, ball is in your court.

[Ham]

if youre trying to find some backhanded way if contacted bigger named djs, i dont suggest it. Theyll probably put you on the junk mail list and even if they'd love your track, theyll never hear it. send it through the proper channels, info@labelname.com or whatever and if they like it theyll contact you via their personal email.

[Reptil]

yes.
watch the small print.
I've read contracts that said: "after the period of 2 years all rights befall automatically to company x (the label)"
instead of that these befall to the artist, like they should. that sort of crap.
basically you sell the rights for a time to a label, so they can print, distribute and sell a number of copies. so a percentage cut is normal operating procedure. don't go into business with people that have no distribution network to retail or active and well frequented front end (digital) to customers.
again.. do a search, there's some information on Gearslutz about contracts.
here's some reading material:
Recording Contracts Explained
Making Sense Of Music Contracts
A Guide To Contracts For Producers

but, first get the stuff registered. U.S. Copyright Office - Online Services (eCO: Electronic Copyright Office)
an album is cheaper (=one thing) than a bunch of seperate songs

[mindseye]

Originally Posted by thefunnel

Just read that shit over, it may be in semi-lawyer speak, but it's usually pretty cut and dry. It can be variable. And advice I received from a big player that makes his living off this is: if the option is no contract or a super restrictive one, choose no contract. Rights are in your favor as the artist rather than the label, so if the track gets big or gets licensed out to others, ball is in your court.

Originally Posted by Reptil

yes.
watch the small print.
I've read contracts that said: "after the period of 2 years all rights befall automatically to company x (the label)"
instead of that these befall to the artist, like they should. that sort of crap.
basically you sell the rights for a time to a label, so they can print, distribute and sell a number of copies. so a percentage cut is normal operating procedure. don't go into business with people that have no distribution network to retail or active and well frequented front end (digital) to customers.
again.. do a search, there's some information on Gearslutz about contracts.
here's some reading material:
Recording Contracts Explained
Making Sense Of Music Contracts
A Guide To Contracts For Producers

but, first get the stuff registered. U.S. Copyright Office - Online Services (eCO: Electronic Copyright Office)
an album is cheaper (=one thing) than a bunch of seperate songs

thank you

[beaumont]

In this day and age its best to get involved with some of the smaller labels on facebook and soundcloud if you have no prior releases or reputation. When I say involved I mean strike up conversations and leave real comments instead of one word wonders. There are so many people trying to do what your trying to do so its best to start small and get some releases rather than shoot for the top. If you make good music word will spread. Once that starts to happen don't rest work harder. Good Luck.

[Systolic]

Originally Posted by Romain74

Hi everyone !

What's the strategie to get some mails ? I mean sometimes Djs let a "promo@email.com" (and half time they don't even read mails because there is too much) but in most case, what's the best plan ?

What style of music? There are a few DJs that have web radio shows and actually ask people to send them tracks, and they claim to listen to everything sent to them.

[beaumont]

Because most of the time your promo's will be thrown in the trash. You have a better chance of getting a release with a smaller label and your music going through proper channels. If your on a smaller label that get's plays from established DJ's there is a better chance to get your music heard. This is not only my advise but info gathered from my peers over the last two decades of making electronic music and as an ex label owner. I have seen many a producer start their career this way.

[thefunnel]

Gotta be careful with small labels though--and this is coming from someone who owns a small upstart label. Most of them, particularly the digital ones, are TRASH and will not promote your music better than you--plus they want to own it, or plaster it in places that will not benefit you, or even make you come off as a newb, just from the association.

Basically, you lose control for zero benefit.

I may not have a marketing budget, but I do know some key players, and I press vinyl. My PR is the minimal approach, allowing the music to speak for itself, and talking directly/forming personal relationships with the DJs and buyers of our music.

I'll take that over the guy with a digital distro to all the digital retailers, and a fancy promo service that has a list of 500 anonymous DJ e-mails, but that's too lazy and cheap to press wax or get in touch direct.

Not saying you gotta be pressing vinyl to be considered legit to me, but you gotta give me something that makes you stand out as a label for me to consider working with you. I've passed on deals from established guys, because it didn't fit my vision as an artist, or my plan for promotion. THAT is the key, create a vision, and approach it with little to no compromise. The hard part is getting sight of that vision and understanding it.

Disclaimer: this is coming from a small-time, essentially unknown producer and label owner that does NOT have all the answers, take it as you will. I'm just going by what I think is right, combining the advice I've gained from respected people who make a living in the electronic dance scene. So, hopefully it works out

[Oh...]

Originally Posted by thefunnel

Gotta be careful with small labels though--and this is coming from someone who owns a small upstart label. Most of them, particularly the digital ones, are TRASH and will not promote your music better than you--plus they want to own it, or plaster it in places that will not benefit you, or even make you come off as a newb, just from the association.

Basically, you lose control for zero benefit.

I may not have a marketing budget, but I do know some key players, and I press vinyl. My PR is the minimal approach, allowing the music to speak for itself, and talking directly/forming personal relationships with the DJs and buyers of our music.

I'll take that over the guy with a digital distro to all the digital retailers, and a fancy promo service that has a list of 500 anonymous DJ e-mails, but that's too lazy and cheap to press wax or get in touch direct.

Not saying you gotta be pressing vinyl to be considered legit to me, but you gotta give me something that makes you stand out as a label for me to consider working with you. I've passed on deals from established guys, because it didn't fit my vision as an artist, or my plan for promotion. THAT is the key, create a vision, and approach it with little to no compromise. The hard part is getting sight of that vision and understanding it.

Disclaimer: this is coming from a small-time, essentially unknown producer and label owner that does NOT have all the answers, take it as you will. I'm just going by what I think is right, combining the advice I've gained from respected people who make a living in the electronic dance scene. So, hopefully it works out

Don't downplay yourself, it's great advice

Especially the bit about having a vision and focusing on it and not compromising

I have had a ton of success way more than I ever imagined but none of it would have happened if I hadn't had stuck to my idea and vision of my branding

Now it's to the point even if my labels folded tomorrow I'd still be ok because I have a brand, it's an identity anywhere you go, I mean yeah there are certain levels that have to be reached for your brand to have pull but the point is your not just some dude, you're X

And people will remember X and want X even if something went wrong where you were at before

Even if X is "fake" and you're really nothing like X, you need X to be you at least when you're being marketed/on stage/whatever


Oh and just invade this got forgot:

Your music needs to kick serious ass and move people. It needs to sound really fvcking good on big systems

If you are good at writing but not mixing, have someone do it for you until you get there

IT MUST SOUND GOOD IN BIG PLACES IF YOU WANT TO PLAY IN BIG PLACES

Don't be a fool, use people to help you and make up for any weaknesses until you sort them out. For all the ego involved in this shit you need to drop it when it comes to making sure you stuff kicks ass BY ANY MEANS NECCESARY

Even if it's mindless "pop garbage" if it sounds like all the other top players on a big boy system you WILL have some measure of success

In a perfect world success in music would all be about the art and emotion but in 2011 it rarely is and if you want to have a very high level of success you need to come to grips with that

Also it helps if you don't go around trashing artists that do already have success because yet again things are nuts in this day and age and you never know who is reading your posts even on some silly Internet forum

Don't burn bridges even if you think the owner isn't looking

[spaceacademy]

Originally Posted by mindseye

As far as licensing, how exactly does that work when dealing with a small/digital label, in a general sense? thanks

The same as it does with a major. The label has the right to licence your music to any third party for any use/reason. Its up to the label to negotiate with the third party over royalty rates and any advances. Whatever the label receives you should get 50%. If you dont hand over the copyright its unlikely any serious label would sign you though.

[beaumont]

Originally Posted by thefunnel

Gotta be careful with small labels though--and this is coming from someone who owns a small upstart label.

Im in complete agreement. You have to be careful who you send a submission to if there established or an up-start. As personal experience I have been screwed by bigger label's more than small ones. My point is make a killer product and get it out there any way you can. Word will spread and if it makes asses shake your on the right path.

[moneyforsluts]

Go to the parties around you, get to know the DJs, promoters, and venue owners, it will open up a lot of doors.

[thefunnel]

and use soundcloud. protect yo shit. i keep a pile of trax in a private folder on my server, for quick send outs to more trusted sources, and if i want to demo to someone i don't know, its coming from SC private. i resisted paying for a more pro account at first since i already had a domain, but the perks are handy. I use the 9 euro per month plan, works fine for me and the label. i think you get a break if u pay for a year upfront.

and to Oh's advice on sounding pro. he's totally right. For a long time I thought I was more or less "there" but then the more I did it, the more I dug into my own shit, let stuff rest for weeks and months at a time, tested on the floor, sent to trusted associates for honest feedback, especially guys who get to play at big shit clubs in europe, the tiniest mix changes can make a huge difference, especially when you don't have the system or enough gigs to test yourself. you gotta swallow the ego, keep it in check, and polish your shit. it can be raw, but it's gotta be polished still and sound good at those big clubs. i save my projects in revision sessions v00 - v10, and I've learned to get between that v09 to v10 can require another 10-20 increments slowly but surely to get that final 5-10% that you need to make it ****ing ace.

I hate to say it, but there's some majorly successful tracks that totally fail in the arrangement/complexity department, but they sound soooo good on the floor that the crowd flips and the dj is happy. to some of us producers, we hear them as weak, simple, lame, whatever...but to the floor, it translates.

[deft_bonz]

Present yourself the best way you can!

That leaves these 2 points:

Pick a few and try to get to know the DJs. It's the same with A&Rs. They just get way toooo much emails from anybody. Only personal contact will give you a slight chance.

At the beginning it's always better to give them something physical. Like a nice looking printed CDR, not a plain CDR. As soon as you know each other better, an email with a link will be sufficient.

[msl]

Its all about who you know, personal relationships. Try and cultivate those. Generic bulk mailings are generally a bad idea, everybody is inundated with promo emails. The old traditional giving them a cd in person at a gig does still work, if the music is good. Better yet give it to them on the way from the airport or play it to them at the after party. Thats why it pays to get involved in your local scene.

Originally Posted by Oh...

IT MUST SOUND GOOD IN BIG PLACES IF YOU WANT TO PLAY IN BIG PLACES

Don't be a fool, use people to help you and make up for any weaknesses until you sort them out. For all the ego involved in this shit you need to drop it when it comes to making sure you stuff kicks ass BY ANY MEANS NECCESARY.

So true!


.

[Faun]

I will tell you for nothing, you are jumping way ahead of yourself here. I wouldn't want to stop you from trying though.

You get more than enough promos from established, signed DJ's to be going through every tune you're sent. This is exactly why you'll find it hard it get genuine emails.

There is some good advice here. Depending on who are where you give it too, you could be far more likely to get it heard if you hand it over on vinyl as opposed to an Asda CD.

[DJ 1UP]

I ran a search and came up with nothing, so let's hear it...

What do you all go through when you want to promote yourself or a great new track you just finished up on?

I personally post the track to Soundcloud and link it to my Facebook 'fan' page and that's about it... I personally try to not be overly pushy on forums or on my personal Facebook or Twitter but I'm interested to hear how you all handle it!

[ohmicide]

Originally Posted by DJ 1UP

I ran a search and came up with nothing, so let's hear it...

What do you all go through when you want to promote yourself or a great new track you just finished up on?

I personally post the track to Soundcloud and link it to my Facebook 'fan' page and that's about it... I personally try to not be overly pushy on forums or on my personal Facebook or Twitter but I'm interested to hear how you all handle it!

I usually just put them on SoundCloud and post the link on my facebook page, personal facebook and on here. But what get me lots of hits for some reason putting a track as my sig on here.