GRP A4

[zahush76]

Originally Posted by CfNorENa

@zahush76: best wishes to your son.

Thanks!
This has been the worst week and a half in my entire life. When it comes to your kids - the effect on the mood, the fears & nightmares.... arghhhh. I really wish this was behind me.

[marino]

Originally Posted by CfNorENa

@zahush76: best wishes to your son.

+1

Thing have a tendency to happen in the worst possible order... hold tight, be patient and dedicate your whole being to your son. When you'll have the time to enjoy your new synth, the pleasure will be double!

[zahush76]

Originally Posted by marino

+1

Thing have a tendency to happen in the worst possible order... hold tight, be patient and dedicate your whole being to your son. When you'll have the time to enjoy your new synth, the pleasure will be double!

Thanks, though i have to admit i "gave in to temptation" and gave it ago for a couple of hours.
All i can say is friggin WOW!
I'm not going to get into details right now. A deeper review will be when i'll have more time.
But i will say this. One of the things i was wondering about is how will it work with my vermona perfourmer.
Well it works like a charm. One of the special things about the vermona is that each of its 4 vco's has its own filter, eg and lfo. It makes it complex and interesting - but less practical as a "traditional" polysynth.

So i took the vermona's audio out into the GRP's external in, set all the vco's on the vermona on square with a bit pwm, all the filters with cutoff wide open, and the eg's on "on" state. And ofcourse i chose the poly playmode on the vermona so that i could play 4 note chords.
That way i ran it thru the GRP's filter(s), loopable envelopes, lfo's etc.
So now i can use the vermona as a full polysynth that goes into a dual multimode filter and everything else. One turn of the cutoff knob effects all the audio coming out of the perfourmer. Very useful.

[isham]

Please give us 2 good news :
- your kid is doing better (most important)
- you will do some demos soon

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[zahush76]

Originally Posted by isham

Please give us 2 good news :
- your kid is doing better (most important)
- you will do some demos soon

-


-

Hi isham!
Yes. My kid is a bit better, though he got what they call a "pick-line", for the purpose of long term infusion.
My wife and i take turns at watching him and being with him in the hospital. So right now i'm at home to grab some proper food, a shower - and of course playing the GRP.
Wow man. It's amazing. Even before starting to play - it's just beautiful to stare at.
Right now i'm "experimenting" with the s&h circuit. It's really mind boggling.
Btw, we have almost no option but to experiment - because the manual (unlike the synth) is a shame. Bad translation from italian to english, some pages are still in italian (they forgot to trabslate...), and most importantly - it's not really a guide. Just a list of functions and their values, with minimum explanations about the theory behind each function and what exactly it does.
You do have to come to a synth like this with programming knowledge beyond the average subtractive synthesis. It takes time and some head scratching - but the results sound fabulous.

As for making demos - i really preffer using the little time i have to explore it rather than make proper demos. I could do a short one with my smartphone - but than i'll get a shower of curses from forum members, saying that if "someone has enough money for a GRP, than he should also have money for a proper camera...".

[Yoozer]

I hope your kid recovers soon .

Recording the audio with the smartphone mic is the biggest transgression, the video doesn't matter that much as long as you're not shaking all the time. Just put the phone on a stable surface aimed at the synth and record the audio separately and sync it later with Movie Maker or whatever, and you'll be OK.

[isham]

Speechless ... Mine is arriving

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCS_U...e_gdata_player

Send from Isham phone

[kpsiegel]

Zahush76 I certainly hope all is going to be well with your son.

My A6 is expected in October. I suppose that given the scant documentation we will have to have a mini user group here on Gearslutz to exchange info and tips. I think this synth should cover any possible mono-synth needs I can imagine.

Have you checked out the midi functionality yet? Does it smoothly integrate with a midi keyboard controller?

[zahush76]

Originally Posted by kpsiegel

Zahush76 I certainly hope all is going to be well with your son.

My A6 is expected in October. I suppose that given the scant documentation we will have to have a mini user group here on Gearslutz to exchange info and tips. I think this synth should cover any possible mono-synth needs I can imagine.

Have you checked out the midi functionality yet? Does it smoothly integrate with a midi keyboard controller?

Yes it does. The midi in general is tight. Of course from the keyboard - everything works petfect: velocity, aftertouch, mod & pitch, etc.
Besides that you have the syncing to midi. The seq syncs perfectly to cubase, including clock division. When i stop and start the transport on cubase, the GRP's sequence stops, resets to the beginning, and starts again on time with no glitches whatsoever. Same is true for the lfo's sync to midi.

[isham]

Any user dares to share a little audio demo or something similar - ?
Next week is so far for me !

[zahush76]

Originally Posted by isham

Any user dares to share a little audio demo or something similar - ?
Next week is so far for me !

Sorry. Can't help you there.
Still with my kid. In the little time i have left i just tweak the sh&%#t out of the GRP.
I will tell you this, though. It has very powerful sound design capabilities. Great strong unique and versatile filters. Yet still - if it matters to you - it nither a moog clone nor a sem clone. It has a sound of its own. Not even trying to be a replacement. So if you're looking for moog and sem sounds - you'd still need to buy those.
If you don't give a rats a#% about imitating those sounds than the GRP is all you need.

[isham]

Thanks Zahush, your comment is very much appreciated (you have indeed another prio),

I'm not expecting a soundalike synth but something powerful and challenging to learn synthesis but still forgiving in the good sounding side of things (as analogue could be ).
So I read 2 future owners in this thread except me. Limited group indeed

[hugsnnalloons]

yeah, i dont care of moog., altough i gonna buy the new two voice... i was hoping the grp to sound original., and 4 sure the sequenser is original enuff for it to be a unique thing.
I gonna get mine in oct, as i was late into this party. dont mind that atall as my new studio is gonna be ready by then.

[zahush76]

Originally Posted by hugsnnalloons

and 4 sure the sequenser is original enuff for it to be a unique thing.

The step sequencer is a dream come true. With quantize on, it is so easy to set a sequence you like. Then what i do is start to audio record it in cubase, let the original sequence run a couple of times as is - and then i start changing sequencer modes, step repeats, i tweak parameters - and it's all recorded as audio into cubase.
Then i start to chop chop, edit, take the parts i think sound best.
In general, i think i have an overall better workflow with this synth - just because it doesn't have patch memory. I tweak a good sound or a groovy sequence - and i know i have no option but to do something with it instantly, otherwise it will likely be gone and never exactly duplicated. I was afraid of this first - but it's a blessing.

[isham]

The big box is there, in my living room , I'm afraid to open it - geezzzz

[zahush76]

Congrats! Waiting game is now over for you as well :-)
Pics or it didn't happen.

[Kulder]

Hello everyone. New to this forum, first post.
I've been following this thread with interest, even more so since I ordered a GRP A4 myself a few months back.
It arrived yesterday and I had about an hour last night to play around with it. Very VERY beautiful instrument, and although I've only been working with it through the headphone out for 1 hour, the sounds I was getting were putting a big smile on my face.
I have one question for other users / owners of the A4 though: I've noticed some odd behaviour in the VCA / EG2 module. When driven via MIDI, the gate / loop / CV VCA switches produced some odd results; i.e. different effects on the sound at the same position of the switch when cycling a switch back and forth several times (hard to describe in more detail, need to do more testing).
Also, I've noticed that when there is no gate on signal via MIDI or sequencer, I can still hear the oscillators in the headphone out at a very low volume (right > left?) (the volume is much lower than when the VCA envelope is triggered), as if the VCA didn't go to 0 when EG2 was not being triggered. Note that none of the HOLD functions which can be used to keep the VCA open were ON at this time.
Did anybody have similar experiences with the VCA / EG2, or should I get in touch with GRP?

Best Regards.

[kpsiegel]

Originally Posted by Kulder

Hello everyone. New to this forum, first post.
I've been following this thread with interest, even more so since I ordered a GRP A4 myself a few months back.
It arrived yesterday and I had about an hour last night to play around with it. Very VERY beautiful instrument, and although I've only been working with it through the headphone out for 1 hour, the sounds I was getting were putting a big smile on my face.
I have one question for other users / owners of the A4 though: I've noticed some odd behaviour in the VCA / EG2 module. When driven via MIDI, the gate / loop / CV VCA switches produced some odd results; i.e. different effects on the sound at the same position of the switch when cycling a switch back and forth several times (hard to describe in more detail, need to do more testing).
Also, I've noticed that when there is no gate on signal via MIDI or sequencer, I can still hear the oscillators in the headphone out at a very low volume (right > left?) (the volume is much lower than when the VCA envelope is triggered), as if the VCA didn't go to 0 when EG2 was not being triggered. Note that none of the HOLD functions which can be used to keep the VCA open were ON at this time.
Did anybody have similar experiences with the VCA / EG2, or should I get in touch with GRP?

Best Regards.

Well I am still waiting for mine but I have read the manual so I will guess on the first issue. Do you have the LFO as a mod source with the LFO set to retrigger on gate or is it set to free run? If free run and it is a mod source I could see the difference. Just a guess.

The other problem I have no idea about but I would definitely get in touch with GRP either way.

I wish I had a midi implementation chart for the A4. There is none in the manual unfortunately. I have sent Paolo an email asking for this if possible.

[Bio]

Also, I've noticed that when there is no gate on signal via MIDI or sequencer, I can still hear the oscillators in the headphone out at a very low volume (right > left?) (the volume is much lower than when the VCA envelope is triggered), as if the VCA didn't go to 0 when EG2 was not being triggered. Note that none of the HOLD functions which can be used to keep the VCA open were ON at this time.

VCA are Voltage Controlled Attenuator (not amplifier), they attenuate the signal.

Some VCA attenuate more than others but if you listen loud enough, all should let some signal pass.

Nothing to worry about if it's low enough.

[Kulder]

Hi, kspiegel, thanks for the quick reply. I'll check this when I get home, and report back. Somewhat doubtful though, because if an LFO was changing the behaviour of VCA/EG2, it should change even when the switches remain in the same position, which was not the case.

Regarding MIDI implementation, I've noticed some odd things happening when fiddling with the up and down buttons under the LCD display, didn't really understand what was going on (more than just transpose function happening, that's for sure), but haven't had the time to check the manual in detail... Other than that, I triggered the A4 via an ipad with midi-out cable (didn't have a MIDI keyboard where I was) and that seemed to work OK.

Anyways, I will report back after more extensive testing.

Originally Posted by kpsiegel

Well I am still waiting for mine but I have read the manual so I will guess on the first issue. Do you have the LFO as a mod source with the LFO set to retrigger on gate or is it set to free run? If free run and it is a mod source I could see the difference. Just a guess.

The other problem I have no idea about but I would definitely get in touch with GRP either way.

I wish I had a midi implementation chart for the A4. There is none in the manual unfortunately. I have sent Paolo an email asking for this if possible.

[Kulder]

Thanks Bio. The volume was low but not low enough to be inaudible when a sequence of notes was playing (i.e. I could hear some sound persisting between notes played, and this sound went on unchanged when no notes were played for minutes. When I turned down all the oscillators in the mixer, the sound went away. As I said though, this was through the headphone out. What I'll do is check the main outs first, and if it's something that seems overly loud there, I'll make a recording and try to post it, in the hopes of getting some more feedback from you guys. This will take me some time though (my A4 is currently working undercover, and staying over at my parents' house, because my wife would kill me on the spot if she found out I'd bought yet another piece of lovely gear - I'll wait for the right moment to spring this on her - you know how it goes...).

Regards.

Originally Posted by Bio

VCA are Voltage Controlled Attenuator (not amplifier), they attenuate the signal.

Some VCA attenuate more than others but if you listen loud enough, all should let some signal pass.

Nothing to worry about if it's low enough.

[Bio]

You can read an interresting thread on muffwiggler about vca bleeding, crosstalk etc... :
Muff's Modules & More :: View topic - audio bleed etc

Lots of great infos.

[zahush76]

Hi there and welcome to the club!!
First - it's always a good idea to contact Paolo. I (thought) i had a tuning problem, which turned out to be just a result of the vco's being "on" on the sequencer without the sequencer actually playing. Paolo instatntly recognised what i was doing wrong and told me how to do it right. So my best advice is contact him. This is a very thought out instrument, and i found no "glitches" yet - apart from my own ignorance.
The midi\program edit section requires reading the manual. Don't skip that part. It's a short manual as it is.

Now, about what you describe - please tell me what's the current position of all the switches in the VCA section.
It could be you're on "hold" position (which gives you constant drone), only with the "level" knob set to a low value? That could be one explanation.
So, there are 3 switches in the VCA section. Tell me what are their positions, and how did you tweak your adsr.

Cheers

[zahush76]

Or better yet - send a picture of your current GRP VCA settings (or the whole synth. maybe it's coming from some place else), and i'll try to figure it out.

[isham]

"Congrats! Waiting game is now over for you as well :-)
Pics or it didn't happen."

[kpsiegel]

Well done. Rather than record a demo of the A4 can you record your wife's reaction when she finds out about it?

Mine is supposed to show up at the end of next month so I have plenty of time to prep up my wife. Fortunately, she is very good about all this stuff.

[Kulder]

Reporting back after more testing.

The first problem (odd behaviour of VCA/EG2 switches) has not occurred again, it must have been something I did wrong the first time. I think it started when I was playing around with the MIDI channel on which the A4 receives note / gate info. When you set it to OFF, and then go back to a channel between 1-16, the setting for transposing pitch when MIDI channel is set to OFF is applied (this can be set in PROGRAM EDIT, in my case it was set to 4 by default) and even when you then switch back to MIDI channel 1-16, the setting remains, meaning that all notes played by the sequencer suddenly go up by 4 octaves. Maybe that's what got me confused. Hope that this makes some sense to somebody.

Anyways, problem solved.

On the other hand, the VCA bleeding (that's what I believe it is now, I think Bio was right) is still clearly present. I don't think it has anything to do with wrong settings for VCA envelope or anything to do with various HOLD settings.

To reproduce this, I only have to turn up one oscillator in the mixer (set to 6-7), choose a setting for the filter (it is most easily audible for the SVF, f.i. set filter routing switch to 12dB, distortion off, level for SVF between 8-10, mode to BP 6dB, any setting of EG2 that produces a note with fast attack, short to medium release, master volume between 8-10, listen with headphone (but I think main outs will behave the same).

After playing a note, either via MIDI or via the sequencer, I get the expected result, but when the ADSR envelope for VCA has done its thing and the synth should go back to silence, I can still hear the oscillator which stays at the pitch of the final note that was played. I can also hear this sound change when I change filter frequency / resonance. It also gets louder when switching on the distortion.

My conclusion is that the VCA doesn't attenuate the sound all the way to 0, i.e. VCA bleeding?

The same is true when using the LPF, but the volume is generally lower than for the SVF.

This is not a dealbreaker for me, I'm very happy with the A4, from what little time I've spent with it I can tell that it's an extremely flexible machine. I own a Voyager XL as well, and the A4 has way more possibilities / different sound. I would just like to know whether this VCA bleeding is normal for the A4 (I don't notice it on the Voyager). Could anybody try to replicate? Zahush, I tried to take a picture of the whole synth but you just can't see the setting of the various switches / pots well enough. I'll try to find a way to document this when I have more time. I'll also contact Paolo and ask him what he thinks.

Regards.

Originally Posted by kpsiegel

Well done. Rather than record a demo of the A4 can you record your wife's reaction when she finds out about it?

Mine is supposed to show up at the end of next month so I have plenty of time to prep up my wife. Fortunately, she is very good about all this stuff.

[Kulder]

Originally Posted by kpsiegel

Well done. Rather than record a demo of the A4 can you record your wife's reaction when she finds out about it?

Mine is supposed to show up at the end of next month so I have plenty of time to prep up my wife. Fortunately, she is very good about all this stuff.

As for your request, I will try to film her reaction but I'll only be able to upload if they have wifi in intensive care .

[zahush76]

Originally Posted by Kulder

Zahush, I tried to take a picture of the whole synth but you just can't see the setting of the various switches / pots well enough.
Regards.

Simply take a couple of pictures - each of a different section. You can capture in one photo, the filter and mixer section. Then make a photo of the left side and i'll try to replicate your settings and see if i get the same results as you describe. I haven't encountered this yet.

[ozy]

Originally Posted by kpsiegel

Well done. Rather than record a demo of the A4 can you record your wife's reaction when she finds out about it?Mine is supposed to show up at the end of next month so I have plenty of time to prep up my wife. Fortunately, she is very good about all this stuff.

Originally Posted by Kulder

As for your request, I will try to film her reaction but I'll only be able to upload if they have wifi in intensive care .

Take some advice from an old man:

a) as soon as the box comes in, forget about it. Tell her you'll open the box tomorrow - "yes, it is something for the studio, but it may wait, nothing important" - and treat her to a nice dinner.

At dinner, have a little stupid gift for her ("stupid" is what you SAY her it is. What it IS, is: something with at least some components made of any shiny metal: gold, silver, platinum).

b) the day after, wait for her to NOT be there.

Open the box.

Install the synth, connect it.

Dispose of the box. Get rid of loose cables, foam, the works.

She asks "where the box is?", answer "oh, the box? Oh, I just installed those new spare parts and got rid of it".

c) DON'T stay up late for toying with the new synth.

Test it between, say, 9 and 11 pm at the latest.

d) play it along your usual instruments, as if you just bought nothing more than a new compressor or, better, a lightbulb.

Something REALLY boring, you know?

e) as soon as you hit a very good sound on the new synth,

that's the moment.

Build a nice riff on it. A melody. Whatever: the style SHE likes. This is the whole point.

Now, take a deep breath, and call her in your studio.

Put your best childish smile on your face,

look at her with that "ok, I did something wrong, but I'm still an adorable puppy" look [you know, the one we boys do when... you know...]

and ask her: "is this riff any good? I somehow like it".

If she says "yes", then you immediately add "it was inspired to me by this synth I was just fiddling with. Oh, by the way, I was just testing it... how do you like it?"

This usually spares me the "two weeks abstinence" treatment.

[btw: I'm just being a clown in order to distract myself from the fact that you people have one HELL of a nice modular, and I don't. I went off modular a few months ago and I don't plan to go back anytime soon. But that's a BEAUTY]