The Prodigy style drum beats
Old 28th September 2011
  #1
Lives for gear
 

Thread Starter
The Prodigy style drum beats

Any of you have any idea how to make them, any of you know how The Prodigy makes them? Do they have a real drummer play or are they sequenced with samples?

I would appreciate any advice or tips.






Thanks
Old 28th September 2011
  #2
Lives for gear
 

They're mostly breakbeats with programmed drums added.

eg.




etc..
Old 28th September 2011
  #3
Old 28th September 2011
  #4
Lives for gear
 

Old 28th September 2011
  #5
Shoot...

Quote:
Originally Posted by razorblade View Post
Unbelievable. I thought they wrote all those tracks. I don't know whether to be dissapointed or impressed.
Old 28th September 2011
  #6
Lives for gear
 
blinky909's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by AtticaEnumbrea View Post
Unbelievable. I thought they wrote all those tracks. I don't know whether to be dissapointed or impressed.
Liam did "write it" but in 20 years, if there are no musicians writing new sample material, what happens?
Old 28th September 2011
  #7
Quote:
Originally Posted by AtticaEnumbrea View Post
I don't know whether to be dissapointed or impressed.
Always impressed, never disappointed.

Now think of what kind of imagination you need to 1) fit this together and 2) cram it in a W30 - no DAWs, no plugins.

Here, another one:

Old 28th September 2011
  #8
Lives for gear
 
metrosonus's Avatar
 

yea but for some reason i don't think they went to nearly the amount of effort liam did..
Old 29th September 2011
  #9
Gear maniac
 
stoltz's Avatar
 

3 eliments

no.1 CHOICE of samples (some loops are chopped, but the groove is kept etc)

no.2 Layering & combining of different drum sounds (ex. different or combined/beefed snares for different parts of the track)

no.3 rhythm & arrangement. liam is a GENUIS at not over-cooking a groove. its all to easy to fall into the "machine gun" trap & call it a quality dance production (he takes his cue from hip hop on this one)

now go find that thump :-P

my take on how it should be done...

http://soundcloud.com/mail-51-5/stoltz-grunt-strut
Old 29th September 2011
  #10
Lives for gear
 
Gringo Starr's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoozer View Post
Always impressed, never disappointed.

Now think of what kind of imagination you need to 1) fit this together and 2) cram it in a W30 - no DAWs, no plugins.

Here, another one:

Wow. I respect sampling as a very creative art form. However Daft Punk have been knocked down a few notches after hearing this. Don't get me wrong, I still love their stuff. Their genius is just in a different area than I originally had it placed.
Old 29th September 2011
  #11
Lives for gear
 
JoaT's Avatar
 

That's the thing with masters of their craft. They make it look so easy it feels like cheating when broken down to fundamentals.

Sampling finished songs has never been for me personally. I don't know what to do with the samples I capture. It always comes out as artificial and I feel the samples limit my options when building a track further. All I can do is watch these in awe as to what can be done with the technique when the maker really knows what he's doing.

Nothing but respect here.

If you want to see something that really feels like cheating, check out Alcazar's Cryin' at the discotheque / Sheila B. Devotion's Spacer
Old 29th September 2011
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by bchamorro View Post
Do they have a real drummer play or are they sequenced with samples?
if you really can't even tell if that's a live drummer or a sequenced beat then I don't know what to tell you...
Old 29th September 2011
  #13
Lives for gear
 
metrosonus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoaT View Post
That's the thing with masters of their craft. They make it look so easy it feels like cheating when broken down to fundamentals.

Sampling finished songs has never been for me personally. I don't know what to do with the samples I capture. It always comes out as artificial and I feel the samples limit my options when building a track further. All I can do is watch these in awe as to what can be done with the technique when the maker really knows what he's doing.

Nothing but respect here.

If you want to see something that really feels like cheating, check out Alcazar's Cryin' at the discotheque / Sheila B. Devotion's Spacer
but when you watch that video that shows how liam did it, and he didn't even have a daw and how much work he did, compared to daft punk, the resources they had and how little they altered the source material, i dont think there's any comparison between the two approaches.

I'm not trying to start a flame war (because im not discussing the quality of the music), but I think it's easier and more worthy to respect someone like liam who was able to do it creatively into a new and original work in spite of the technological hurdles. But people like daft punk and justice to me, are over glorified Djs who put down whole pieces of songs younger people have never heard of.
Old 29th September 2011
  #14
Lives for gear
 
blinky909's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gringo Starr View Post
Wow. I respect sampling as a very creative art form. However Daft Punk have been knocked down a few notches after hearing this. Don't get me wrong, I still love their stuff. Their genius is just in a different area than I originally had it placed.
you starting to understand why some of us who have been around for 20+ years are so cynical and unimpressed by so much - using loops is not new, the trick was finding new stuff, not d/l'ing a fill pack from piratebay.
Old 29th September 2011
  #15
Lives for gear
 
Gringo Starr's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by blinky909 View Post
you starting to understand why some of us who have been around for 20+ years are so cynical and unimpressed by so much - using loops is not new, the trick was finding new stuff, not d/l'ing a fill pack from piratebay.
I always thought that using others peoples music was unimpressive. However since getting in to all of this recently I've lightened up a bit on my view of sampling. I just got my first sampler. But I have no desire to sample other peoples music. I want to take the many songs I've previously recorded and take samples from them. I also want to record my own sounds and see if I can create my own drum kit by smacking things together, putting them into the sampler, and messing with them until it sounds like a drum. So I do want to sample stuff but my own stuff. To each their own though. I'm not saying my way is better than any other way. But my way will make me feel more satisfied in the end. And that's what it all comes down to.

Sorry for leading this topic off course.
Old 29th September 2011
  #16
Lives for gear
 
metrosonus's Avatar
 

I think that's the difference though, at least the intrinsic one is the depth of the process involved in making the music.
Old 29th September 2011
  #17
Lives for gear
 

il give you a tip that no one has mentiond yet.

1.Make and layer your beat, now when it sounds ncie but aint got enough in you face thwack

2.put a compressor on the master bus and crank it right up to the top, so the compression pretty much ruins all the dynamics.

3. bounce down the loop, and take the comp off your master buss

4. get you beat and chop it up using a auto beat tool like beatmapper or battrey 3, now draw the dynamics in using a evelope

5. add a bit of eq and comp/ transient designer on each sample...

This has only worked for me a few times and it really depends on the samples you layer to get a nice thick sound out of it OR use sampled loops which is what i do, (i did chop up a old amy winehouse sample) in the past i have had some huge sounding drums being made out of this method, and they sound like prodigy... well up and in yourface.

Hope this helps

Take it easy
Old 29th September 2011
  #18
Lives for gear
 
metrosonus's Avatar
 

that's more or less what I do.. but I beat the hell out if it using custom effects chains in Live.. but I just record it into a clip and then chopt it into new clips or drag it to the drum racks.
Old 29th September 2011
  #19
Lives for gear
 
CoolColJ's Avatar
 

Not hard, back the the day I did it with S-550 sampler drum loops, offset a few and layered over tr909 or synth drums

These days - it's quite easy to do, with all the drum plugins around.
Chop up a drum loop, rearrange it, then I added some drum sounds I created from scratch in Stomper, as single samples and created another pattern on top - then dumped through "analog tape"

ie something I did today
http://soundcloud.com/coolcolj/drum-and-bass-beat
Old 29th September 2011
  #20
Lives for gear
 

Thread Starter
I'm not sure what you guys are telling me.

From what I understand, I should find an audio drum loop and use drum replacement technique with 1 shot samples?
Old 29th September 2011
  #21
Lives for gear
 
CoolColJ's Avatar
 

take a drum loop, chop it up into 4 to 16 slices - Plenty of software and drum VST plugins that can do this.
rearrange the loop so it sounds funky fresh
then create another drum pattern with synth drum sounds or 909 etc, and then play the 2 together - layer them , get creative


Offset one for freaky feels - I used to do this with an 808 and 606 drum machine synced to each other.
808 was normal, but the 606 was running a different timing pattern, and offset. Put it through a Boss se-50 multifx and it sounded kick ass and fresh!
Kinda like what Aphex Twin was doing....
Old 29th September 2011
  #22
Lives for gear
 

Thread Starter
Got it now. Thanks!

I'm not used to making drums/beats with drum loops, so this is pretty new to me.

I have another question.


Lets say for some reason you wanted to sidechain your bass track to your drum kick. You would sidechain it to the 808 kick you layered and not the the loop's original drum kick, right?
Old 29th September 2011
  #23
Lives for gear
 
CoolColJ's Avatar
 

The heavier of the 2, but you can always try both

Doing this kind of drum loop thing is pretty easy in Geist - try the demo out
Old 29th September 2011
  #24
Lives for gear
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoolColJ View Post
The heavier of the 2, but you can always try both

Doing this kind of drum loop thing is pretty easy in Geist - try the demo out
Will do, just found Geist, looks awesome.

But you can't really side chain to the loop since the loop is 1 big audio file, not separate elements, I might be wrong.
Old 29th September 2011
  #25
Lives for gear
 
CoolColJ's Avatar
 

Once chopped up it is separate, sorta, and side chain works on audio anyway

Geist allows each slice to be a separate thing
Old 29th September 2011
  #26
Lives for gear
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoolColJ View Post
Once chopped up it is separate, sorta, and side chain works on audio anyway

Geist allows each slice to be a separate thing
Awesome


from what I can see, Geist will take a loop and turn it into MIDI too... with separate things (hat, snare, kick etc..), right?
Old 29th September 2011
  #27
Lives for gear
 
CoolColJ's Avatar
 

yeap - loop into midi trigger, not the actual drum pattern

Old 29th September 2011
  #28
Lives for gear
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoolColJ View Post
yeap - loop into midi trigger, not the actual drum pattern

aaah, I see... just slice it.

Cool
Old 29th September 2011
  #29
Lives for gear
The Prodigy hardly knows how to do it the same way anymore. Lots of samples were interacting rhythmically. The melodic parts were actually rhythms themselves. Guitar parts were 80s/70s grooves. Just slicing drum loops up won't cut it. You will end up sound like The Crystal Method instead.
Old 29th September 2011
  #30
Lives for gear
 
CoolColJ's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sammytaters View Post
The Prodigy hardly knows how to do it the same way anymore. Lots of samples were interacting rhythmically. The melodic parts were actually rhythms themselves. Guitar parts were 80s/70s grooves. Just slicing drum loops up won't cut it. You will end up sound like The Crystal Method instead.
Back in the 90s, us breakbeat folks, who were heavily influenced by the Prodigy, didn't slice up loops, there was no such thing.
What we did was trigger the same drumloop in staggered fashion.
Slicing more or less does the same thing , depending on how you trigger it. 1/4 note slices works much the same way, as back then

I did this Amiga mod back then using such a technique. That was a typical way breakbeats were employed back then




I also sequenced my own drum sounds and treated them like loops in much the same way. But these days you can resample your own beats and do the same! That's how I did the breakbeats in my Ragga Jungle track back in the 90s with regular 909/synth drums and sampled drum rolls. Pretty much like the Prodigy

New Reply Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook  Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter  Submit Thread to LinkedIn LinkedIn  Submit Thread to Google+ Google+ 
 
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
 
Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.