TR-909 vs SCI Drumraks + Roland RE-501 Space Echo

[Daniel_Che]

Hey guys,

I am not reasonable here. Let me know your thoughts. Please advise.

STUDIO SETUP: Metric Halo 2882, Juno 60, Vermona Mono Lancet, Yamaha HS-80, Akai MPK-49 Beyerdynamic DT770-Pro, iMac i7, Rode Mic

GOAL: To add a drum machine and FX to current studio setup.

BUDGET: $2000

MUSIC: Deep House, Tech House

DILEMMA: Whether to buy only Roland TR-909 or Sequential Circuits Drumtraks together with Roland RE-501 Space Echo for the same amount of
money. All units are in excellent shape and would be buying it from the first owners.

Appreciate your thoughts.

[ahmo]

909.

get tape echo later if you want, and drumtracs later if you want too, a good 909 is harder to come by.

[Daniel_Che]

Originally Posted by ahmo

909.

get tape echo later if you want, and drumtracs later if you want too, a good 909 is harder to come by.

i was thinking about that, but on the other side i was offered drumtraks and 501 tape echo in a perfect condition, just like the 909, and dont won't to let go..such a rare opportunity...although you can always from time to time find those machines, but the 909 is harder i guess

[living sounds]

A 909 needs a mixing console and outboard for processing IMO.

[msl]

Blasphemy I know but...

Grab the Space Echo and buy a Mbase11 for your kicks. Use samples for the rest.



.

[Daniel_Che]

Originally Posted by living sounds

A 909 needs a mixing console and outboard for processing IMO.

i could do it with metric halo easily i think

[Daniel_Che]

Originally Posted by msl

Blasphemy I know but...

Grab the Space Echo and buy a Mbase11 for your kicks. Use samples for the rest.



.

yeah, totally..nice alternative..although for the kicks only i would grab vermona's kick lancet, check out the video...

‪Vermona Kick Lancet‬‏ - YouTube

[living sounds]

Well, I owned a 909 and other machines as well, including the Mbase. I wouldn't use a 909 with an audio interface and deal with all the problems of sync, conversion, latency etc., you could simply use samples. As for the Mbase - didn't like it, no real midrange punch. The little plugin from the other thread sounds way better to me (didn't think I'd ever say that, but there it is).

[Daniel_Che]

Metric Halo is an amazing interface, you should really check it out, no latency, amazing routing capabilities, onboard fx..

regarding the 909 sync problems, i believe the latest OS v.4 solves that
I've been using samples, also have akai pads on my midi keyboard, but i really want to experience the good drum machine and interact with it

Originally Posted by living sounds

Well, I owned a 909 and other machines as well, including the Mbase. I wouldn't use a 909 with an audio interface and deal with all the problems of sync, conversion, latency etc., you could simply use samples. As for the Mbase - didn't like it, no real midrange punch. The little plugin from the other thread sounds way better to me (didn't think I'd ever say that, but there it is).

[Goa-Dubs]

Well i got an 808 the other day and you certainly cant do this on anything else.Full of charm and nuance....and thats that

[lain2097]

Well I actually had a drumtraks (sold) and 909 for a time, get a 909 over a drum traks - samples would do just fine for that machine. I found the drumtraks just meh. Sounded very similar to a linndrum but not the same extreme pitch range, very 80s.

But yes as mentioned a 909 needs some sort of processing to really shine, I love distortion.

[CfNorENa]

Originally Posted by msl

Grab the Space Echo and buy a Mbase11 for your kicks. .

Or grab the 909 and buy a Strymon El Capistan for your (simulated) tape delay.

[PhonoquO]

I would skip the 909, drumtraks and echo. Good sound for half the money would be emu sp-12 turbo + akai s-950. The UI and swing and obviously sound on the sp are just banging. You can run mono out with no processing and it just sounds beautiful! The akai could be your ticket for longer samples and basslines, the filter is hot.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Gearslutz.com App

[fooddude]

I used to have a 909 and like to make house. Now my main drums are samples from my MPC 60. Sounds good still; but the biggest thing is the kick doesn't cut through a song as much. But at the same time, I like 12-bit sampled hats and snares and claps much more than the raw 909; gives it a but of a compressed and processed sound. The kick is the only thing I really miss. Used to have an S900 too, and now have the S950; havent tried it for drums yet.

I still want a 909 again, as well as an 808..maybe in the future... it's nice to have that real raw analog power! ...every other drum machine...I don't mind one bit using 12-bit samples.

All the suggestions in this post are likely all very great. I'd love an SP/Emax as well

[Dubtek71]

I would take the 909 over the SCI and space echo. I would also choose it over an sp-12turbo too. In fact I sold my sp-12 to get my 3rd & current 909. I wouldnt say the sp-12 is banging. The drums have some gritty drityness to them yes. 12bit digital vs analog to different birds really. The ideal is to have both.

Really though, really I think it's about getting a couple of really great pieces of gear. Even if it only one or two items. Find a couple things you really love and learn em. Besides like I told fooddude, if you buy it and you don't like it you can sell it and get your money back.

[fooddude]

yup...the 909 bangs! I think you need it even more so if all your synths are powerful analogs too. Analog synth pads, stabs and bass easily dwarf my sampled 12-bit kicks and drums. With a 909, it just feels much more balanced and made to be.

[Futureman84]

I used to have a 909 and I don't like em. I find it quite boring and over used.

I still have my drumtraks, but it hardly ever gets used.. I got better drum machines to use right now.
Although, Chromeo sure make real good use of the drumtraks, it's plastered all over their stuff.

After buying a crap load of machines over the last 18 years, I'd confidently say that the SP12 turbo is king.
You get the best of everything.
It saves it's samples when you turn it off (unlike sp1200)
It sounds damn huge and fat
It's just great to use.
You can use it a large variety of ways.. Ie, I also use it for some smoking bass lines.

Sure, with the SP and drumtraks etc, you don't get the idiot proof way of programming (step time) and you don't have as immediate volume controls of sounds compared to the 909 (although you can change sounds volumes, just not dedicated volume knobs)
[you can use the separate outs via a mixer, but this may not suit you]
But the SP12 is one of those machines, that when you get, you'll be like "hell yea! Why the F didn't I buy this earlier"
Well, that's what happened to me.
I was lucky, my SP12t cost me $500.. But knowing what I know now, I'd easily pay $1k+

Back to the drumtraks, I modded mine with extra EEPROMs so I could switch between different kicks, snares , hihats etc.. Loads of fun.
There are companies now selling 909/808 samples for the drumtraks. Check em out. At least with those samples, you'll have a different take on a 909 to use.

[Daniel_Che]

thanks for the input! what kind of processing are you talking here, compression, low cut..?

Originally Posted by lain2097

Well I actually had a drumtraks (sold) and 909 for a time, get a 909 over a drum traks - samples would do just fine for that machine. I found the drumtraks just meh. Sounded very similar to a linndrum but not the same extreme pitch range, very 80s.

But yes as mentioned a 909 needs some sort of processing to really shine, I love distortion.

[Daniel_Che]

Originally Posted by CfNorENa

Or grab the 909 and buy a Strymon El Capistan for your (simulated) tape delay.

good alternative as well! Strymon El Capistan only has one input, right? cause i will have to have 2 inputs so i can hook up my Juno 60, or to put it straight into interface and as a send fx

[Daniel_Che]

thanks for the tip man!

Originally Posted by PhonoquO

I would skip the 909, drumtraks and echo. Good sound for half the money would be emu sp-12 turbo + akai s-950. The UI and swing and obviously sound on the sp are just banging. You can run mono out with no processing and it just sounds beautiful! The akai could be your ticket for longer samples and basslines, the filter is hot.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Gearslutz.com App

[Daniel_Che]

couldn't agree more, yes all suggestions are great, it is matter of taste, preference and ultimate usage, i would definitely like to combine the 909 with my sample library

Originally Posted by fooddude

I used to have a 909 and like to make house. Now my main drums are samples from my MPC 60. Sounds good still; but the biggest thing is the kick doesn't cut through a song as much. But at the same time, I like 12-bit sampled hats and snares and claps much more than the raw 909; gives it a but of a compressed and processed sound. The kick is the only thing I really miss. Used to have an S900 too, and now have the S950; havent tried it for drums yet.

I still want a 909 again, as well as an 808..maybe in the future... it's nice to have that real raw analog power! ...every other drum machine...I don't mind one bit using 12-bit samples.

All the suggestions in this post are likely all very great. I'd love an SP/Emax as well

[Daniel_Che]

exactly, i've always wanted to have a great piece of gear, rather than bunch of machines with no purpose, at the end of a day it's making the best out of what you got, right?

Originally Posted by Dubtek71

I would take the 909 over the SCI and space echo. I would also choose it over an sp-12turbo too. In fact I sold my sp-12 to get my 3rd & current 909. I wouldnt say the sp-12 is banging. The drums have some gritty drityness to them yes. 12bit digital vs analog to different birds really. The ideal is to have both.

Really though, really I think it's about getting a couple of really great pieces of gear. Even if it only one or two items. Find a couple things you really love and learn em. Besides like I told fooddude, if you buy it and you don't like it you can sell it and get your money back.

[living sounds]

I replaced my 909 with an SP-12 Turbo as well. I like the sound of the 909 and have got the outboard and console to make good use of it, but there's just no way to make it sync properly and keep in time with the rest. Even with perfect external clock generated by a sync - lock it still does its own thing which doesn't match well with the rest of a playpack. The SP-12 on the other hand has its own timing but DOES match well with other stuff.

If I were to get an analog drum machine it would be the 808, just layer it under the rest of the playback, instant goodness.

[Daniel_Che]

What about Vermona DRM1 Mk3? Pure analog, it does sound crisp, weird, polish, punchy, metallic and lush..dunno if it is right drum machine for making deep house though..more minimalistic approach if you ask me

‪Vermona DRM-1 Mk III Analog Drum Synth‬‏ - YouTube

but then again, I've seen people are combining Vermona DRM with OTO Biscuit 8bit crusher to make it more dirty...does anyone have experience with that?

also, i know there are better drum machine from the 80s than SCI Drumtraks, but you can't tell me that this does not sounds good:

‪Sequential Circuits Drumtraks Drum-Machine‬‏ - YouTube

[Daniel_Che]

that is excatly what i have in mind to do with the Drumtraks, there's a guy in UK who sells 808 eproms, I mean it will not sound the same, but you will have something which most of others dont, right? i think for deep house Drumtraks would be a nice addition

Originally Posted by Futureman84

I used to have a 909 and I don't like em. I find it quite boring and over used.

I still have my drumtraks, but it hardly ever gets used.. I got better drum machines to use right now.
Although, Chromeo sure make real good use of the drumtraks, it's plastered all over their stuff.

After buying a crap load of machines over the last 18 years, I'd confidently say that the SP12 turbo is king.
You get the best of everything.
It saves it's samples when you turn it off (unlike sp1200)
It sounds damn huge and fat
It's just great to use.
You can use it a large variety of ways.. Ie, I also use it for some smoking bass lines.

Sure, with the SP and drumtraks etc, you don't get the idiot proof way of programming (step time) and you don't have as immediate volume controls of sounds compared to the 909 (although you can change sounds volumes, just not dedicated volume knobs)
[you can use the separate outs via a mixer, but this may not suit you]
But the SP12 is one of those machines, that when you get, you'll be like "hell yea! Why the F didn't I buy this earlier"
Well, that's what happened to me.
I was lucky, my SP12t cost me $500.. But knowing what I know now, I'd easily pay $1k+

Back to the drumtraks, I modded mine with extra EEPROMs so I could switch between different kicks, snares , hihats etc.. Loads of fun.
There are companies now selling 909/808 samples for the drumtraks. Check em out. At least with those samples, you'll have a different take on a 909 to use.

[James Meeker]

Drumtraks is good--I owned one for about five years, but it is limited. And easy to sample. The 909 is a lot more versatile and being analog in nature a lot more flexible.

Here's a novel suggestion:

Concussor Modular Synthesiser | Analogue Solutions

Build a Concussor drum machine modular! Mix and match CR78, 808 and 909 sounds in a single rack system. It's expandable over time, and you can patch your merry heart out.

Two grand gets you in the ballpark to put together a workable system. Another thousand in expansion and you'll be on your way to total analog drum bliss.

[living sounds]

Owned a DRM-1 MK1 for a while, most useless piece of gear I ever had, aside from the MBase...

[Daniel_Che]

impressive!

Originally Posted by James Meeker

Drumtraks is good--I owned one for about five years, but it is limited. And easy to sample. The 909 is a lot more versatile and being analog in nature a lot more flexible.

Here's a novel suggestion:

Concussor Modular Synthesiser | Analogue Solutions

Build a Concussor drum machine modular! Mix and match CR78, 808 and 909 sounds in a single rack system. It's expandable over time, and you can patch your merry heart out.

Two grand gets you in the ballpark to put together a workable system. Another thousand in expansion and you'll be on your way to total analog drum bliss.

[Jomox]

Jomox 888 or 999 could be your ting.

[Daniel_Che]

perhaps! besides the x-filter, whats the main difference between 888 and 999?

Originally Posted by Jomox

Jomox 888 or 999 could be your ting.