Why do we blame our tools ha?
It is not the tools!
And not I do not use Abelton.
there are real issues that greatly impede productivity and it can be a real crappy thing when those features are some of the main things that got you to drop the cash
midi clock sync was that way for me, it drifts horribly bouncing up and down a few bpm nonstop, like a horrible dj that can not beatmatch
so i lose that functionality and everything that relied on it, like using ableton to trigger samples and midi sequences, this is a game changer for me as now i am just using it as a multitrack recorder at this point, so many hours and creative sparks gone due to fighting with it trying to get it all to work as advertised
I just hate how you can't record different automation in to each clip. I don't want to draw it with the envelope tool! and I don't want to do it in arrange mode all the time.
I am pretty sure you can record different automation to different clips, then launch these automation clips to apply to whatever you want to alter. But maybe I am confused and you are correct in saying you can only do it in arrange mode.
Abelton is cool but I actually love the FL studio piano roll and that's why I use fruity as a vst inside abelton which works great . IF you want to compose quickly in abelton you need to be using a midi keyboard and recording loops of midi data , this is a huge advantage over FL studio . But FL is great for just writting in a few notes and changing the lenghts and maybe adding some shuffle manually . Stuff like this takes me a lot longer in abeltons piano roll .
So long story short you can have the best of both worlds , but my advice is dont use the plugins that come with FL studio , i try to use it just as a drum sample player/seqeuncer and abelton is my actual DAW .
Ableton Live is really nice as a tool and some things that can be a PITA with other sequencers are simplified and made easier with Live. So it's an essential thing to use as a toolkit and for live performance, but to me it sounds different than other sequencers like Cubase (not as good IMO).
But even in linear mode, the way it works with audio is so much more intuitive, which makes it easier to arrange parts. It's simpler in a lot of ways, more straight forward, and just more user friendly than other sequencers and that I think is the big plus for it.
If your first paragraph is true, then just stop posting circles within circles of what amounts to nonsense and go make music. Beyond that, try making original music that isn't remix based. I know remixes are the hot thing right now and are a good path to the very rare bit of monetary success to be had in EM these days, but if you let your brain try to invent everything from the ground up rather than having the foundation premade you may find yourself worrying much less about software and more about music.
And music is probably what you should be worrying about really.
No one cares what software you use besides you unless its a matter of sharing project files or some such. Outside of that, all they care about is if they enjoy the music. You don't have to impress your peers or your listeners with software or hardware or whatever, let your music do the impressing.
As it's been said before a trillion times, actions speak louder than words.
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Well said,
By the way, I thought your track was really cool, nice one M8!
Can I ask you how that works. Is fruity available as a .dll that you place in your vst folder?. I've never heard of that. Thanks.
SInce FL Studio 8 its available as a VSTI. So you just drag FL Studio VSTi on to a midi channel and it works like a vst plugin . Theres like 16 outputs from the vst that you could route to audio tracks or whatever in abelton.
So its like FL studio is working within Abelton and its all in time etc when you press play. I couldnt find a video on you tube but if you have a recent install of FL studio and Abelton on your sytem you can probaly already try it , just open abelton and look through your plugins for FL studio multi and drag this on to a midi channel and 'Roberts your Mother's auntie' etc .
I'm a bit drunk at the moment but its pretty easy to work out through trail and or error. Again though my top tip is don't use all the garbagey plugins that come with FL studio , just use it as a drum sequnecer inside Abelton which is good for arranging and recording midi and audio parts
If Ableton fixed it's horrible arrange window, and went 64bit I'd be way more interested.
At this point, I'd say it's almost more likely that any other major DAW out there like Pro Tools, Logic, or Cubase would copy and implement a "clips" scheme before Ableton get's their act together on the other end.
As it stands now, I'd put my money on Logic doing it really, really soon. They already have "non-linear jamming" half implemented in the DAW as it stands.
Logic has had "touch tracks" for years and years and years. You can throw midi regions to be triggered (clips) or even pack a bunch of different midi regions of different instruments or entire songs into folders to be triggered (scenes) all assignable to a note on your keyboard. The only downside is you can only use MIDI instruments, you can't use audio without having to print it and load it into a sampler instrument. But you can do that in about 10 seconds in Logic by simply selecting the regions in a track and converting them to a sampler instrument in one keystroke.
It's only a matter of time until Apple "garagebands" this little feature hidden in the environment and makes it more obvious to the average user that it's even there for use. All they have to do is put audio into the scenario and make it look pretty for the kids with it's own special, fancy window...
-B
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"music is the best" - Frank Zappa
Stuff like this takes me a lot longer in abeltons piano roll .
Erm, why? All you do is double click to draw then stretch the notes by hovering on the edge? It's probably the fastest midi editor of any daw, all you need to do to change the grid is right click and then you can even do away woith the notes you're not using.
I wonder if the people who go an about the FL piano roll do so because it's the only one they know how to use, Cubase probably has the best laid out and most compressive, fruity loops you need to go inot 3 tier menus to change a basic setting.
SInce FL Studio 8 its available as a VSTI. So you just drag FL Studio VSTi on to a midi channel and it works like a vst plugin . Theres like 16 outputs from the vst that you could route to audio tracks or whatever in abelton.
So its like FL studio is working within Abelton and its all in time etc when you press play. I couldnt find a video on you tube but if you have a recent install of FL studio and Abelton on your sytem you can probaly already try it , just open abelton and look through your plugins for FL studio multi and drag this on to a midi channel and 'Roberts your Mother's auntie' etc .
I'm a bit drunk at the moment but its pretty easy to work out through trail and or error. Again though my top tip is don't use all the garbagey plugins that come with FL studio , just use it as a drum sequnecer inside Abelton which is good for arranging and recording midi and audio parts
that is very cool, man if only that were possible in osx
Erm, why? All you do is double click to draw then stretch the notes by hovering on the edge? It's probably the fastest midi editor of any daw, all you need to do to change the grid is right click and then you can even do away woith the notes you're not using.
I wonder if the people who go an about the FL piano roll do so because it's the only one they know how to use, Cubase probably has the best laid out and most compressive, fruity loops you need to go inot 3 tier menus to change a basic setting.
Sure, if you want simple MIDI editing, please use Ableton. Although, intuition is unique to each person, so your personal attacks are not necessary.
Regardless, I'm commending the extensive options as well as general ease of use for me, not how "simple and fast" it might be.
From the transposition, quantizing options, "Riff Machine", flams, and so forth, I believe Ableton is not as advanced. I also, personally, don't care for loading certain things as "MIDI FX", IMO, it'd work easier for me as a simple menu attached to the window itself.
However, this is optimization for ME, and for my ease of use.
The only fact in this thread about the piano roll is that it has much more in depth and extensive options for the creation, editing, and morphing of MIDI notes, especially when you're not using anything besides a computer.
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Ambient House Meets Western Guitar, May 2013
that is very cool, man if only that were possible in osx
Well, it's not FL studio but if you want to step sequence drums inside OSX Live, there are tons of options, from Maschine to Microtonic to Nerve to Numerology, all of which work quite well. There are also Max4Live step sequencers but honestly I don't love any of them.
Always preferred Sonar and absolutely love Sonar X1 with it's prochannel, screenset toggles, and overall ease & professional feel. For years other DAWs didn't have precise track DB monitoring for fine tuning, but I assume that is different now. This was one reason I always preferred Sonar.
That being said, I wanted to venture into Live Looping and the RC-300 wasn't gonna cut it for me (boy he can dance lol). So I went with Live and an APC40. Then I hooked up Bome's free MIDI translator to an old Digitech RP20 pedal and I can control just about anything in the software with my feet via MIDI keystrokes. It is so fun and I am just scratching the surface. This is simply impossible to do in other DAWs. The clip view is wonderful and it fits my needs perfectly. It is exactly what I needed.
I still prefer Sonar for linear production because I am used to it and I like the user interface. There are a lot of detailed maneuvers that I can make editing in Sonar which I cannot in Live. So it just depends on the application. Use Live for live shows, performances or to create while looping. Mix and master in Sonar if you don't like Live's Arrangement view.
As long as the gear and the software are working for you instead of the other way around, then you are going to be able to have fun making music. If you don't have the money, time or capacity to learn a new product, ask why you are really wanting it and just get back to using what you have. Chances are you already have more than enough and one more purchase isn't going to help you get what is inside OUT. Then again, this is exactly what Ableton Live did for me, once I learned it.
I use Live, and FL. I find Live's workflow much faster, but FL does have automation curves, and the sliders in the piano roll are dope. Live lets you just do what you need to do in the quickest way possible. FL has just way too many steps to do simple tasks like rendering midi to audio, automation, and going back and forth between the sequencer and playlist is a hassle. They should give you a choice to lock the playlist so you can create different midi patterns on the playlist, without creating new patterns in the sequencer. Such a time consuming pain in the ass
Sonar X1 does the whole looping thing with the Matrix view and step sequencers too.
X2 takes it further
Isn't the Matrix View still limited to prerecorded loops? If so, it really doesn't even compare to what Live can do. I am glad to see they recognize the value in what Live offers us though.
PS: Now I miss FL again. Isn't it coming to iPad soon or something?
its been out for the iphone and ipad for a minute now, and i believe its only 15 bucks, its actually quite sweet from what i see. ableton is for this
and, as the title says, (live) performances.
fl studio btw to who ever the hell said oh wait about playing live with it.
is able to do the same, they even released that, deckadance or whatever, and are totally following the ableton lead on the pad controller and performance based business.
I have used and seen a few DAWs, protools, logic, reason, fl studio, ableton
acid(way back)
and honestly, i dont know what it is, maybe its a mac thing (i own a pc) and that makes it even more bizarre, but protools, and ableton live, to me, just look..... so god awful.
and that is bizarre because macs are blessed with, BEAUTIFUL displays RETINA screens, that even massage your pupils while bombarding you with pixels. but the programs look like they could have been made in 95. Something about the jagged text, plain, detail-less windows, i dont know. they literally make me sleepy, like when i try to study, or read something i have to, and dont want to. The only other daw im really interested in picking up at somepoint is reason. I like the workflow in it. I like the racks, and i like the native plugins. but i love fl studio.
I never realized how capable fl studio was when i first messed around with it years ago, and over the last few months, i picked it back up, with a vengeance after using reaper to record a few things a while back. and learned exactly, what you get, with fl. I mean, image-line might not ever update the lay out, or give any other skins, or, change..... anything. but, they have SO MUCH, and the price is SO LITTLE. To anyone who doesnt like fl, or thinks its a joke(oh and yes i will agree, the fl user crowd in general... is.... ughh....) The product is 300 bucks FULLY LOADED with all the synths fx and blibbidy blah blah. I just realized how great harmor, maximus, and slicex are. i mean, they literally go, and have Gol, i believe is his name, make a solution to match or supercede a competitors product, like massive. sure harmor isnt MASSIVE, but, in some ways its far better. and. its less money for anyone. Im just saying, if you dont think fl studio is worth a **** you obviously havent looked very closely, or your just being narrow minded and opinionated. i thought it was a joke at one point. never realized it was a SERIOUS music making machine. But now daily i am surprised. literally to the point i wonder, why i didnt just take the time to explore and learn what came with it, instead of going out, and finding 3rd party alternatives for things. *slaps forehead*
As for piano roll sequencing, as far as I can tell all sequencers are about the same, it is a horrible way of making music and bells and whistles don't change anything
In order to "make music" (as opposed to playing back loops), you do need to get actual notes sequenced. There are only two basic ways to do that:
1. Play them on a MIDI keyboard
2. Paint them in, one by one
Or a combination of the two.
It's not the piano roll itself that's "horrible", it's the fact that you have to do actual work in order to *compose*. At the end of the day, if you want an original composition, you have to make a conscious decision about each single note you enter into the sequencer, what note to put in, where in time to put it, how long it should sustain etc. no matter the input method. I can't think of a better way to display this information on a computer screen than a piano roll. Of course if you don't care about notes, the piano roll is useless.
..and going back and forth between the sequencer and playlist is a hassle. They should give you a choice to lock the playlist so you can create different midi patterns on the playlist, without creating new patterns in the sequencer. Such a time consuming pain in the ass
..
You don't have to place stuff in the pattern-block sequencer if you use a clip in the playlist instead. Same thing the other way around: if you use the block patterns, you don't have to duplicate it in the playlist. Otherwise you're doing the same thing twice.
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“This is the most beautyful place on Earth. There are many such places.” Edward Abbey Desert Solitaire
In order to "make music" (as opposed to playing back loops), you do need to get actual notes sequenced. There are only two basic ways to do that:
1. Play them on a MIDI keyboard
2. Paint them in, one by one
Or a combination of the two.
It's not the piano roll itself that's "horrible", it's the fact that you have to do actual work in order to *compose*. At the end of the day, if you want an original composition, you have to make a conscious decision about each single note you enter into the sequencer, what note to put in, where in time to put it, how long it should sustain etc. no matter the input method. I can't think of a better way to display this information on a computer screen than a piano roll. Of course if you don't care about notes, the piano roll is useless.
Music is created in your head, writing it down is just decoding.
Just figured out how to make a pattern unique in the playlist in FL, so my previous comments are void now. Still think live is faster imo, but not better or worse than FL. Just faster, and the GUI is easier to manipulate
I decided to throw this question here. When I have my Voyager hooked up to Ableton I have it running via the External Instrument. Everything triggers fine, but when I make a sequence the Voyager doesn't simply play it back, but makes the filter randomly sweep. Is there a setting on Ableton where just notes are triggered and the filter and modulations are left alone?
I decided to throw this question here. When I have my Voyager hooked up to Ableton I have it running via the External Instrument. Everything triggers fine, but when I make a sequence the Voyager doesn't simply play it back, but makes the filter randomly sweep. Is there a setting on Ableton where just notes are triggered and the filter and modulations are left alone?
I don't think there's a setting that'd just let you turn all modulation on/off, but check the clip's MIDI envelopes & make sure you haven't accidentally recorded anything there (the parameters with automation are marked with a red dot).
There are a good many that use Ableton for getting quick ideas down and arranged and Rewire it to a different DAW. I'd do it if it wasn't the only thing I'm using at the moment. You can finish tracks with it, but I always feel like the other DAWs are better at mastering and perhaps a wee bit on mix down. I utterly dislike the EQ on it, and it seems that the redo the did on it is a slight improvement, but I don't feel like I can shape things to the extent that I tend to. I cut freqs alot!
<sarcasm> Until they can get my input from the random things I bang on (i.e., pots and pans) without mics I will be dissatisfied. That and I want to sound like Stockhausen... screw sounding like (insert current pop phenom).</sarcasm>
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ableton is for this
