Mutronics Mutator I/O Setup
PTB
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#1
27th November 2010
Old 27th November 2010
  #1
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Thread Starter
Mutronics Mutator I/O Setup

How do I connect the Mutator to operate as one stereo filter across my master stereo track?

The manual states two options:
  • Mono input --> stereo output by connecting channel 1 input only
  • channel 1 input/output and channel 2 input/output for two separate mono filters

However, I want to apply the Mutator as a stereo filter to my master stereo track. In other words I want to go into the mutator as stereo (not mono) and come out as stereo.

My settings now are as follows:
D-BOX TRS output # 3 --> Mutator channel 1 TRS input
Mutator Channel 1 and channel 2 TRS outputs --> D-Box TRS inputs 3 & 4 (btw... do I need to connect both channels on the mutator outputs or just channel 1?)

With these settings I have to tweak both rows of Mutator filters and the effects are applied to the left and right speakers respectively not in unison.
So again, how can I use one row on the Mutator to apply a stereo filter effect to my master stereo track?

Thanks!
#2
27th November 2010
Old 27th November 2010
  #2
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clusterchord's Avatar
 

you connect stereo to inputs and outputs.

there's no way to sync controls of both filter units for manual operation. you have to tweak both cutoffs yourself. only thing that can be synced is LFO.


however, one (partial) workarround, if you have a MIDI eqipped mutator, is to make your filter or resonance draws in DAW and apply them to both midi channels for both filter channels respectively.

another is to use external CV control (0-5V) and route it thru a multiple, to both channels CV input for cutoff. this way you will have filter control for both channels, from a single pot, or whatever modulation source you feed into the mutiple.




i haven't used it in stereo in a while. almost always dual mono on two mono sources.. so my memory may be playin tricks but it think thats pretty much it.


its a farily simple analog machine, so i think its not much work to have env follower CV output fitted, also you could add a switch that would make one filter cutoff pot the master. etc.. little DIY or if you have a capable tech..
PTB
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#3
27th November 2010
Old 27th November 2010
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Quote:
you connect stereo to inputs and outputs.
Taken from the manual: "... when a jack plug is plugged into channel 1 input only, the signal is also fed to channel 2 input. This connection is broken if another jack plug is inserted into channel 2 input, in which case both channels operate independently."

I guess when the say mono in and stereo out they mean stereo panning effects for a mono source.


Quote:
there's no way to sync controls of both filter units for manual operation. you have to tweak both cutoffs yourself. only thing that can be synced is LFO.
Well that pretty much $uck$ I thought I could use the Mutator similar to my old FilterFactory to apply low and high pass sweeps to my master track. My idea was simple. Once my track was complete...run it through the Mutator for filter sweep automation giving it that live feel with a super juicy analog filter. I guess this is my fault for not understanding the unit fully.

Any reason why one filter channel is placed in the left speaker and the other to the right speaker?

Quote:
i haven't used it in stereo in a while. almost always dual mono on two mono sources.
Hmn my pro one and se1x both have great filters so no need to run them through the mutator.

I don't have the midi version and I also don't want to modify it. Now I need to think of other uses for it.

Perhaps you can help me brainstorm using two filters...
  • individual drum hits from my vermona or 909
  • drum loop processing
  • maybe run my sleepdrone through it
  • I do have a few old casio keyboards (SK1/PK1) that could use the filter
  • use it alone for sound effects

If I assigned the cv out from my pro one to the cv in on the mutator would the mutator trigger every time a note is played on the pro one? I'm sure this could be interesting for creating sub bass grooves since the mutator gets lowww.

Thanks for the response.
#4
27th November 2010
Old 27th November 2010
  #4
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Grimbog's Avatar
 

This is all off the top of my head (currently not in the studio), but in theory you should be able to hook it up to midi, or use cv. Usually the filter is mapped to midi note on (note value, much like key-tracking) in midi mode, and you have to set up two channels, but I reckon you should be able to map them both to a single midi controller with a knob and just use it to have both channels synced.

Alternatively, if you've got a Kenton Midi->CV unit you can just route two CV outs to each of the mutator in's, and again just manipulate the pitch.

Hmm, I'm saying this as I'm also about to re-cable the studio, and want to use the Mutator as a synced stereo unit. Actually, just realised it might be really cool to get the LFO out on an MS-20 and then morph the LFO shape when it feeds the Mutator! Ooo, gonna try this!
#5
27th November 2010
Old 27th November 2010
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clusterchord's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PTB View Post
Any reason why one filter channel is placed in the left speaker and the other to the right speaker?
dont understand what confuses you with connecting mutator? its all pretty basic ..

you have a two channel unit. if you want to process a stereo mix, feed the stereo output i.e. two channels from DAW into mutators two channel inputs.

you get two individually filtered channels on outputs. connect this back to 2 inputs of your audio card. arm two mono tracks in your DAW for recording with corresponding hw inputs assigned. press record. play with knobs.

now you got two filtered channels in your DAW. whether they're in your "left or right speaker" depends where you pan the recorded channels.


Quote:
Originally Posted by PTB View Post
Hmn my pro one and se1x both have great filters so no need to run them through the mutator. .. Perhaps you can help me brainstorm using two filters...
well i don't use it in that manner either, as analogs cover that. but mostly for drum machines like my SP-12, bass guitar, guitar, feeding some loops or any other audio perfomances from DAW. we even tried electric violin the other day. and sometimes used it on Waldorf XT. yeah , try it on that Casio.. it likes digital boards, makes them liquid..

most of the time i combine the env filtering, with manual tweaking of cutoff, resonance, env depth, and sometimes LFO. and record this as a performance.





btw, if you want to, you can be rather precise doing stereo sweeps with both hands on both filter channels at once. maybe not as elegant as you envisioned but most certainly doable.

alternatively, perhaps you didnt understand my suggestion for external CV source. .. simplest would be, get something like cheap Roland EV-5 pedal, have someone modify it into CV pedal i.e. that it sweeps between 0 - 5V. usually done with a 9V battery and a few electronic parts. then make a Y cable from there and connect it to both Mutators CV INs at the back. now you have yourself single control for both channels. i never did that cause the manual approach works for me when i want stereo.


Quote:
Originally Posted by PTB View Post
If I assigned the cv out from my pro one to the cv in on the mutator would the mutator trigger every time a note is played on the pro one? I'm sure this could be interesting for creating sub bass grooves since the mutator gets lowww.

Thanks for the response.
yes and no. yes Mutator will fire its own envelope follower, but triggered by the amplitude of the incoming audio i.e. notes played, not CV.

CV input on mutator is for CV control of the position of filter cutoff. not for triggering envelope. CV out from Pro One, gives you steady voltage corresponding to keyboard note you played or sequencer/arpeggio played.. when you connect this to CV in in the Mutator, it gets interesting bcs now you have it track the notes you play with its filter frequency. if the resonance is zero or mild settings, it acts nothing different than usual KBD TRACK parameter on most mono synths. however, if you turn the resonance to the max, and mutator self oscillates.. you get a sine wave, that acts like a VCO.


perhaps you should read up a little bit about the whole CV, GATE and TRIGGER concept, there are some great articles on the net that'll help you shed some light.

cheers
PTB
Thread Starter
#6
27th November 2010
Old 27th November 2010
  #6
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimbog View Post
Hmm, I'm saying this as I'm also about to re-cable the studio, and want to use the Mutator as a synced stereo unit. Actually, just realised it might be really cool to get the LFO out on an MS-20 and then morph the LFO shape when it feeds the Mutator! Ooo, gonna try this!
I just completely re-built/re-wired my studio and it took me almost a whole week. I changed the midi I/O and line I/O and what a pain in @$$. Worst part is trying to open a project now because they are all under the old settings so you have to "re-wire" your projects too. Word of advice... if you can; re-wire everything as you had it (unless you want to change it for specific reasons).

Thanks for the mutator points but I don't have the midi model.
PTB
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#7
27th November 2010
Old 27th November 2010
  #7
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Thread Starter
See my responses in bold below...

Quote:
Originally Posted by clusterchord View Post
dont understand what confuses you with connecting mutator? its all pretty basic ..

you have a two channel unit. if you want to process a stereo mix, feed the stereo output i.e. two channels from DAW into mutators two channel inputs.

you get two individually filtered channels on outputs. This is what I don't want as the effects will get too crazy and out of control. I just don't see that working well and IMO can clutter up a mix. connect this back to 2 inputs of your audio card. arm two mono tracks in your DAW for recording with corresponding hw inputs assigned. press record. play with knobs.

now you got two filtered channels in your DAW. whether they're in your "left or right speaker" depends where you pan the recorded channels. Yes that's normally true but I was sending a mono track out (for testing purposes) into channel 1 of the mutator and both filters were active and panning the fx left and right. The channel in my DAW was at 12 o'clock.

well i don't use it in that manner either, as analogs cover that. but mostly for drum machines like my SP-12, I'm sure you can do either, but are you sending individual drum outs into the mutator or the whole drum bus output? bass guitar, guitar, feeding some loops or any other audio perfomances from DAW. we even tried electric violin the other day. and sometimes used it on Waldorf XT. yeah , try it on that Casio.. it likes digital boards, makes them liquid..Yes, I'm going to test the casio boards

most of the time i combine the env filtering, with manual tweaking of cutoff, resonance, env depth, and sometimes LFO. and record this as a performance.

btw, if you want to, you can be rather precise doing stereo sweeps with both hands on both filter channels at once. maybe not as elegant as you envisioned but most certainly doable. Agreed but that forces me to have both of my hands on the cutoff knobs instead of one hand on cutoff while the other hand can tweak other parameters.

alternatively, perhaps you didnt understand my suggestion for external CV source. .. simplest would be, get something like cheap Roland EV-5 pedal, have someone modify it into CV pedal i.e. that it sweeps between 0 - 5V. usually done with a 9V battery and a few electronic parts. then make a Y cable from there and connect it to both Mutators CV INs at the back. now you have yourself single control for both channels. i never did that cause the manual approach works for me when i want stereo.

yes and no. yes Mutator will fire its own envelope follower, but triggered by the amplitude of the incoming audio i.e. notes played, not CV.

CV input on mutator is for CV control of the position of filter cutoff. not for triggering envelope. CV out from Pro One, gives you steady voltage corresponding to keyboard note you played or sequencer/arpeggio played.. when you connect this to CV in in the Mutator, it gets interesting bcs now you have it track the notes you play with its filter frequency. if the resonance is zero or mild settings, it acts nothing different than usual KBD TRACK parameter on most mono synths. however, if you turn the resonance to the max, and mutator self oscillates.. you get a sine wave, that acts like a VCO.


perhaps you should read up a little bit about the whole CV, GATE and TRIGGER concept, there are some great articles on the net that'll help you shed some light. Yes, I need more knowledge in this area. Thanks

cheers
Thanks CC
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