How to achieve THAT phatness in the low end ?!

[Eixpanhol]

Hi Guys,

So for all of you understand what i'm talking about just take a short listen to this drop at 04:00 min, of one of my favourites producers 'Avicii' :

YouTube - Tim Berg - Alcoholic (Original Mix) OFFICIAL

The Kick and Bass are so PHAT and Warm that it surrounds your body!!!

My question is how can i possible achieve this result? I try to layer a kick with a sine wav sub bass but i feel that i'm missing something to get that extra warm and power .. i also applied a Waves CLA-3A on my sine sub bass and it is amazing but still miss something, i think.

All the best

[Tarkovsky]

I was going to say something like sines, mastering but...

Jesus that's fat.

Thanks for posting this, sweet track! Wish I knew!

[Tarkovsky]

just want to point out a couple of things from your post.

Firstly unless the kick doesn't have any lower freqs layering sines usually doesn't work unless they're very well tuned (pitched) to the kick. You're better off with a sample that already really has it. Wave Alchemy Drums Tools 01 has some amazing kicks.

If you're using a subby bass often you dont want your kick punching that low, which makes using the sine even more redundant/unhelpful.

This track...
The bass hits on the off beat. The kick doesn't feel that low. There are also lots of harmonics in the 200ish range so you can really hear the sub.

[rasseru]

Originally Posted by Tarkovsky

The bass hits on the off beat. The kick doesn't feel that low.

+1 thumbsup

[living sounds]

It's one sinewave going down fast from 180 Hz to 40 Hz (kickdrum), another sound with less amplitude going up (the off beat bass, so to speak), some low end stuff in the 50-90 Hz region (layered acoustic kick) - and one massive sinewave at 45 Hz. All very cleverly done in regards to phase.

[spasmdaze]

All very cleverly done in regards to phase.

i understand the concept of phase/phasing...but care to elaborate how one might carefully line up these waves to make sure they don't sum to 0/cancel?

would this require some tight eq'ing and a keeping a close eye on a spectrum analyzer? inverting phases?

[living sounds]

Originally Posted by spasmdaze

i understand the concept of phase/phasing...but care to elaborate how one might carefully line up these waves to make sure they don't sum to 0/cancel?

would this require some tight eq'ing and a keeping a close eye on a spectrum analyzer? inverting phases?

Probably. Also moving the tracks around in time to find the perfect spot. And there are tools to change the phase by degree. Again, it is cleverly done...

[SWAN808]

I wonder if something like Lowender plugin was used for this - that can create terrifying amounts of bass....

[Jonathawkes]

A fat low end is something that everyone struggles with, There's no single way of achieving it because it's very dependant on whats happening above the bass, and all the instruments sharing those low frequencies. There are a lot of tricks for getting the low end to pump, but I think one thing that you should avoid is just going in and boosting the crap out of the low end. There's a lot less bass in a "phat" sounding track than you would think. Starting with sounds that are big and warm to begin with is a good start... as opposed to trying to alter a weak sounding kick, but you can always try side chaining if its not cutting through.

[living sounds]

So I sat down and tried to recreate that track's low end, but after some time I connected the 909 and then added a few synths and basically ended up jamming. ;-) Reminds me a little of Plastikman's "Consumed".

So here's that little track, playing with stuff in real time:

www.scherer.de/Download/MuchLowEnd.mp3

[RobJB06]

Is that a Moog phaser on the lead line?

[peter_martin]

Originally Posted by Tarkovsky

The bass hits on the off beat. The kick doesn't feel that low.

Listening to it in my 10 in sub, and doesn't seem THAT crazy low. Really snappy beat but seems to be limited a bit too much to really breathe in a push pull kind of way that it could be.

Sine waves and pitch mod my friend that are all required, don't even think any special processing tools to get the basic sound right.
Avoid having the sub bass hit with the kick (its not really side chained so its a matter of programing).

Cool track, nothing all that crazy though.

To point out, for this style of music and to make deep low end that really translates is a good sub setup, triangulated proper, and in a good room.

Before I got my sub and room right for the low end I came about the same questions hearing a track like 'how did they do that' as its kind of hard not fully hearing it down there. In fact there where many times I pulled my hair out and spent too much time making decision on the overall spectrum and not just the lowend. Having a full spectrum system and good room, dudes makes the WORLD of difference and I work like 15x faster. Hearing those lower octaves is so critical in this kind of music.

Plus its all in the sine and pattern avoiding the kick, and the kick having most of the low end rolled off.


To achieve the phatness you must understand (and hear) the phatness down there.

[living sounds]

Originally Posted by RobJB06

Is that a Moog phaser on the lead line?

Bingo! ;-)

[alphaproject]

Yea...I've heard alot lower bass in my headphones that are really good at low end stuff..... but there's a big difference to Tight bass with a low end arc, then what I normally do wchi is just really, really LOW, like sub 20hz stuff that shakes my room and it's barely heard but it's felt in my walls...and my windows rattle.

I prefer theater type stuff to this but I appreciate the work that creates this type of music but it's much too repetitive to sit and listen to since I don't hit clubs. I do love the way the bass comes in, then kick... I have a sample that's simply a low 40hz and a 20hz bass sound somewhere that if I sample can be insane sounding.....but not many people's systems can even hear it unless you have the right equipment if u catch my drift.

As far as low end goes, I actually likied Muchlowend better. There's much more going on then just beats, which I prefer.

I'll include a sample of a short song which has a very, very low bass kick.