House / Techno / Trance producers - you still using outboard?

[kraku]

I create a lot of my analogue style sounds with external synths. Drums are done completely ITB and so is mixing, effects and editing, but the regular analogue synth sounds come usually form my eurorack modular. FM, and samples are done ITB.

I route all my out board synths to a patch bay and from there to AD converters.

[AJ Reynolds]

i would use more outboard if i could afford it.

i mix and arrange everything in the box using software EQ's and compressors. mono synths and 90% of my drums come from hardware. i've got a distortion pedal use synths as effects processors and filters but i normally get the sound i want then record into the computer.

[BTByrd]

Originally Posted by AJ Reynolds

i would use more outboard if i could afford it.

+1 on that. Hardware synths are a necessity for me, but mixing and whatnot is usually an ITB affair due to financial and space reasons.

[cryophonik]

I use both hardware and software about 50/50 for synths. Drums are 100% software - I use Maschine a lot, but that's software with a hardware interface. For hardware synths, I just route them into my MOTU 828mkII and use it as my mixer, record it, and finish mixing ITB. I also incorporate "real" instruments (e.g., bass, guitars, percussion, vocals) - those are obviously recorded live, but sometimes I'll cheat and use samples in Kontakt 3, Trilian, etc.

[Oli]

Originally Posted by BTByrd

+1 on that. Hardware synths are a necessity for me, but mixing and whatnot is usually an ITB affair due to financial and space reasons.

Me too. I use a hybrid set up, but definitely try make the most of my computer in the process. I only have a few channels of I/O to play with, and not a very flexible mixer.

I think if I were just starting out now, I would probably have less devotion for my digital hardware synths, too. I got hooked on keyboards when computers were only capable of MIDI sequencing. I think software is really coming into its own, though I still find it less convenient and fun to work with. The value for money is hard to ignore, and it's so easy to stack more software into a studio.

I love analogue hardware, though I don't own much. I try to get DIY projects done to help with the affordability on that front.

I'm aiming to do multi-tracked ITB mixing, and patch bay, but have to figure out how exactly I will spend my money to get there. I'll probably end up with a Presonus Lightpipe, and 4 Behringer ADA8000s. Of course, money is a driving factor there. I'll have to see how far I can get with my own mods to an ADA8000. The alternative would be to hack together my own ADAT breakout, but that means more effort, and comparable cost.

[Liam Judah]

I like to use outboard as much as possible on the way in to get a "good sound" (or one that I like at least) from go. Once itb though, I stay there. For a while I was using a lot of softsynths, and went away from external compression. Even sold one of my outboard compressors because I had stopped using it. Now that I'm back for the most part with external synths, I'm looking to go back and pick up a good stereo comp (and a few more of these ----> ).

[mike vee]

I use 2 hardware synths (JX-3P and ESQ-1) and an Ensoniq DP/4 4 channel hardware effects processor. I use those three things on all my tracks, then mix it with Sonnox, API and SSL plugs in Cubase 5. At lease, that;s what i;ve been doing for 2 weeks haha. It's nice because between all those things I have a good amount of analog sound and a little bit of hiss/noise coming in...just enough for some character.

My next step is to add a Dangerous D-box for analog summing along with the real SSL and API compressors.

[PeteJames]

I don't have a mixer and route directly into my soundcard. I've got a couple of synths and counting. When I buy a drum machine I may consider a mixer as i'll need about 10 inputs. Maybe an allen and heath zed? Ideally i'd like an interface with many high quality inputs for a decent price - not many interfaces seem to have more than 6 mono analog ins :-( I'd need 8 mono's for drum machine, 1 stereo for my poly and a mono, 1 for guitar, a mic, and more spare for future synth purchases. What should I do? I do prefer mixing in the box (in theory) as I'm only learning and can go back and make improvements when I get better, but I prefer to be away from the computer.

[JBVries]

Originally Posted by kraku

I create a lot of my analogue style sounds with external synths. Drums are done completely ITB and so is mixing, effects and editing, but the regular analogue synth sounds come usually form my eurorack modular. FM, and samples are done ITB.

I route all my out board synths to a patch bay and from there to AD converters.

My exact situation as well...

[Tarkovsky]

Hybrid.

I use some external synths and some soft synths, I usually track em as midi and freeze if I need to use something else... simple.


I personally don't see why anyone would choose to mix OTB unless they had the money and space to burn.

IMO In terms of some styles I think mixing in the box really makes life simpler. Programming complex automations seems to make more sense when you see the progression on the timelines.

I notice a lot of the detroit guys seem to love their hardware, and this makes sense when working in that style as the tactile mixer would lend itself to subtle changes in the mix. Yet something like tech-house where you're automating lots of builds that are integral to the arrangement equally seems easier using a DAW.

But WTF do I know... I've only ever mixed ITB, but I just don't fancy paying more for the same or less functionality.

If I had more hardware and money it might make more sense.

[aeonlux]

Originally Posted by GregR

So with fx and dynamics plugins getting better all the time, do you still use outboard?

Yes.

ITB plugs can do some incredible things, no question, but they don't deliver the kind of tone I hear in my Eventide H8000FW Ultra-Harmonizer, Roland RE-201 Space Echo, or Schippmann Ebbe und Flut - among many other analog and digital outboard devices.

That said, I do think and feel a hybrid approach works wonders - and channel-based dynamics and EQ is one area where ITB delivers for me.

As it concerns the use of an external mixer, I have an A&H Mixwizard 16:2. Nothing fancy, but as it concerns doing anything dubby, real-time hands-on control of the mix and the effects is just fun, fun, fun to me.


cheers,
Ian

[Konketsu]

Hybrid here, too. I like having and using an analogue mixer and hardware outboard, but I also use Reaktor and a few choice effects plugins in Logic.

Edit: Oh, how I do it. A&H MixWizard 8 buss into an RME Multiface2 using the tape returns, with effects on the desk sends and synths and stuff plugged into the board.

[living sounds]

I used to do the mixdown ITB with synths and outboard all plugged into the converters. This wasn't practical however (problems with latency, system stress etc.) and in the end mixing it through a good console sounds better, more relaxed and finished. So now it all goes through the console: Synths, samplers, Softsynths/-samplers. I went from ITB to hybrid to mostly OTB.

[crufty]

for what its worth, 3-5 years ago, I would listen to satellite radio and things sounded very in the boxy/sw. Today, if its itb or otb, it sounds more hw. i forget what i was listening to, some dj mix when all of a sudden this what had to be an FR XS just jumped thru the radio, demolishing the other track it was mixed with. sounded niiiceee.

but sometimes i hear a song and there is no weight to it, and i think

when i listen to the arman van helden trance around the world mixes, and those trancey verb'd out leads, are those mostly itb, otb, or a combo?

[arkon]

I spent the last 8 years or so ITB and have recently moved back out of it

i dont know whether its the endorphin response making your brain think hardware sounds better or it actually does sound better .....

but it certainly more enjoyable . perhaps that just translates to better mixes and tracks

you dont have to have mega expensive outboard either , some great cheap compressors floating around , multi effects units are dirt cheap now due to software

basic setup is 16 channels of outboard synths combined with 8 channels of audio from an old rme hammerfall card under cubase sx 5 . outboard eqs , comps and fx via the busses and sends . all running through a a&h zed428 for mixdown. recording simply press play on the daw and run a live mix . complex automation and editing are still avaliable , just bounce to an audio track in the daw and return via one of the 8 channels through the mixer again .

so far I find this better than recording external sources and processing into the daw and mixing down there

[Brainchild]

I never use inboard.

[alexp]

Im all OTB. I dont do much house these days, but when I do my methods dont change.


alexP

[kraku]

Originally Posted by JBVries

My exact situation as well...

[nikseven]

i track with compression most of the time (distressor, 2-1176), eq ITB, and fx i run a hybrid of outboard and ITB (all of my more esoteric and character effects come from spring reverbs and analog delays, while more utilitarian reverbs are done ITB, usually with TL Space).

[controlvoltage]

all my synth layers are created on hardware analogs, recorded and mixed in the box with ITB fx (because I blew all my money on synths and have no outboard fx).

All my drum hits are created "outside the box" (either synthesized on the analogs or recorded with a Zoom H4 and sample-edited in Cool Edit) and then sequenced in the box (usually in Live's drum-sample contraption).

Occasionally I wonder if I wouldn't get a lot more music made if I didn't insist on crafting every fuggin' synth patch and drum hit from scratch.

Then I think to myself that I probably like crafting individual drum hits about as well as I like making actual tunes.

[4damind]

Hybrid.
I have not found some replacements for my Virus or Nord Lead.
For the future I'm more interested in some good outboard synth instead of more plug-ins. But the FX for mixing and mastering are in the box and I'm happy with it, so I will not change this

[cfalk]

like most here.... hybrid set up, but i favor outboard whenever possible. i still prefer to mix out of the box and most of my sounds and instruments come from hardware. i love the flexibility of working with audio in a DAW(ableton). sometimes i set up an efx loop to process audio from Live thru external efx(space echo,DP4,etc..) on mix down or just plain ol' resample stuff thru outboard. i'm really open to anything that works for that particular situation. i do use ITB efx, but i still think outboard has more character, especially reverb.

[andivax]

for house, all synths is external (virus, dsi, nord). all mixing - ITB.

for psy trance/fullon, all synth is going from software (vanguard, surge, v-station, massive). very rarely i use nord lead for "cut thru the mix" angry fm leads and virus ti. all mixing - ITB.

[shaft9000]

It used to be a chore when I only had a Mackie and a couple soundcards, but since I got the ZED R-16 console my mixes have opened up thanks to the flexibility. This board enables use of the EQs for recording AND mixing in and out of the box however you want. Routing is cake with this thing.
Although ITB plugs can sound very good, i don't hear the dimension i get when i use aux sends out of the board to the H3000 and Rumour. Reverbs in particular just sit better in the mix; i can dial in the send levels and EQ the return just so, and in a much more natural way than ITB.
ITB I had to either tweez every little thing(jumping from window to window) or rely on default mixing setups to save some time. Now it flows comfortably, quickly and sounds better because of it.

[Fishy1500]

I have a hybrid setup as well

Hardware:
Synths - I use these the vast majority of the time, my favorites being the Virus TI, Nord Stage (this is an awesome keyboard, plus the epiano sounds are great), and Voyager
Outboard - I use Logic when mixing but leverage outboard gear (summing mixers, compressors, pre's, EQ) on the busses. I really like having this hybrid setup

Software:
Synths - I really don't use soft synths much. The only exception being like Ivory for piano sounds, which is the best purchase I've made in the softsynth/sample library category
Plug-ins - The waves plugins have been working great for me, a bit pricey but I try not to think about that too much since I use them a lot

[JBVries]

Originally Posted by arkon

i dont know whether its the endorphin response making your brain think hardware sounds better or it actually does sound better .....

but it certainly more enjoyable . perhaps that just translates to better mixes and tracks

I love this statement because finally after talking to some producers I well respect, and hearing them say they are completely ITB, for a while I decided that's how I should produce too. Thinking "well if they are achieving "XyZ" quality ITB, then thats how I should produce too.

I've come to understand though that I just love to twiddle knobs. It makes me feel happy and therefore more inspired.

Also, I find that working OTB and especially with analog gear makes me write differently in more of a performance style production as recall of a patch out my FRXS to modular rig to...... is just a pain to document and recall so I find myself writing and recording on the spot as opposed to making a sound and sequence knowing that I can come back to it at any moment.

[Digital Network]

I mainly work with my hardware synths and sometimes, I use plugins too : Logic's plugins such as ES2, ES1 and ESP, Blue and Predator from Rob Papen, Arturia stuff, ...

All the FX (delay, reverb, ...) are ITB.

I make summing with SPL Mixdream XP. I use also SPL dynamaxx, Twin Tube, Preference Mic-Preamp and Transient Designer (RackPack) for tracking.

For mixing, I use Eq and Comp ITB.

To create my sounds, I prefer tweak real knobs.