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Arp 2600 without keyboard / with midi?
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Audi Uh Oh
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#1
26th January 2010
Old 26th January 2010
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Arp 2600 without keyboard / with midi?

Howdy guys,

Can you use an Arp 2600 without its keyboard?

And if so (I assume via midi... CV to midi), specifically how do you connect for a CV / midi converter?

And lastly, is there a converter recommended for an Arp 2600?


As always, your guys' help is greatly appreciated!
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26th January 2010
Old 26th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Audi Uh Oh View Post
Howdy guys,

Can you use an Arp 2600 without its keyboard?

And if so (I assume via midi... CV to midi), specifically how do you connect for a CV / midi converter?

And lastly, is there a converter recommended for an Arp 2600?


As always, your guys' help is greatly appreciated!
You certainly can.
Any cv-to- midi interface will do.
I'm using the Philip Rees one for my 2600

MIDI to CV converters from Phil Rees

although I think PR is no longer in biz.

You can try the Doepfer MCV4 as well:

Homepage englisch

connection is a no-brainer. cv/gate out and midi in of the interface to cv/gate in of the Arp and then midi out of your master keyboard.

Cheers

Phaidon
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26th January 2010
Old 26th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaidon View Post
You certainly can.
Any cv-to- midi interface will do.
I'm using the Philip Rees one for my 2600

MIDI to CV converters from Phil Rees

although I think PR is no longer in biz.

You can try the Doepfer MCV4 as well:

Homepage englisch

connection is a no-brainer. cv/gate out and midi in of the interface to cv/gate in of the Arp and then midi out of your master keyboard.

Cheers

Phaidon

I am very grateful for your time, care and help Thank you!

One more quickie.... I've read that some Arps need/like some of its other connectors to work (I may be very wrong and am still learning) ... do I also need to go out any other triggers from the Arp?

(I apologize if I don't even know what I'm asking!)
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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The 2600 plays well with others; I use it with FR Orb & Revolution sequencers directly.
Other analogs like the Moogs need some CV scaling to play in tune, but the 2600 is spot-on. I run CV to the multiple, and out to each osc. The gate goes into the ADSR and/or AR trigger in on the 2600 - it works well. I can plug in a MIDI controller and run MIDI->CV via the FR sequencers for regular keystuff too.
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Audi Uh Oh View Post
. I've read that some Arps need/like some of its other connectors to work (I may be very wrong and am still learning) ... do I also need to go out any other triggers from the Arp?
You're probably talking about using the Trigger out.
No need to.With the Gate out, it's fine.
Audi Uh Oh
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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Cool guys, thank you so much!
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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Oh... one more thing!

Oh, one more thing...

Is there a midi to CV converter you recommend that works particularly well with the Arp 2600? (The simpler, the better)

Thanks!
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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Just get the Doepfer MCV4
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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I would go for a different midi - cv converter like the Kenton
The ARPs like triggers as well as gates. The Kenton's send trigger and gate simultaneously as you use an aux output to send the trigger.
On the 2600 you should also use a splitter cable (1 mini jack to 3 or 4 minijacks as you need to send the CV to all three VCO's and go straight into the VCO jacks (and probably filter tracking)
But basically it works like any other voltage controlled synth. Main thing being ARP's have gate AND trigger. THey don't necessarily need it though but I use mine that way.
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlmorley View Post
I would go for a different midi - cv converter like the Kenton
The ARPs like triggers as well as gates. The Kenton's send trigger and gate simultaneously as you use an aux output to send the trigger.
On the 2600 you should also use a splitter cable (1 mini jack to 3 or 4 minijacks as you need to send the CV to all three VCO's and go straight into the VCO jacks (and probably filter tracking)
But basically it works like any other voltage controlled synth. Main thing being ARP's have gate AND trigger

Brilliant, I was hoping you'd chime in.

So, Kenton out, four mini jacks (3 to each osc and 1 to the filter? Do I have that right?)

Is there a specific Kenton you recommend? Ideally the easiest that still does what you say. (Also, does Kenton sell the splitter cable you suggest?

Thank you SO much!!!

P.S. Oh, and when you say the Arp has gate AND trigger... can you please explain a bit more? Am I going to take the output of the Kenton and go into each gate or trigger? My Arp arrives soon, so I don't know it well yet. Your help is GREATLY appreciated!!!
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27th January 2010
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Hi
Yes. If you want the filter to open as you move up the keyboard, one into the filter cv input and one for each VCO (of course it depends what you are doing!)
You can use the multiple on the front panel if you like. cv into one multiple jack and 3 minijacks out to each vco. It's just that there are only those 3 but it works to start with.
The cables I use are like this picture BUT mono jack and I have 3 of them chained.

I found this explanation of the ARP trig thing which explains it well. As mentioned, it's only really to allow multiple triggering which may or may note be desirable.

ARP synths all used 'multiple triggering'. That is, they used a combination of a gate and a trigger pulse so that the envelopes re-triggered every note regardless how you played them.

Most other synths (like the MiniMoog) used only gate so that if you played, say, C and then, while holding that note, played, say, the B below it, the pitch would change but the envelope would not be re-triggered. This is actually a more 'natural' effect for things like trills on solo instruments (like flute, trumpet, violin) where the player does not articulate every note with a new breath or bow stroke, whatever. On these gate-only synths, if you wanted the envelope to re-trigger every note, you had to play separate notes.
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlmorley View Post
Hi
Yes. If you want the filter to open as you move up the keyboard, one into the filter cv input and one for each VCO (of course it depends what you are doing!)
You can use the multiple on the front panel if you like. cv into one multiple jack and 3 minijacks out to each vco. It's just that there are only those 3 but it works to start with.
The cables I use are like this picture BUT mono jack and I have 3 of them chained.

I found this explanation of the ARP trig thing which explains it well. As mentioned, it's only really to allow multiple triggering which may or may note be desirable.

ARP synths all used 'multiple triggering'. That is, they used a combination of a gate and a trigger pulse so that the envelopes re-triggered every note regardless how you played them.

Most other synths (like the MiniMoog) used only gate so that if you played, say, C and then, while holding that note, played, say, the B below it, the pitch would change but the envelope would not be re-triggered. This is actually a more 'natural' effect for things like trills on solo instruments (like flute, trumpet, violin) where the player does not articulate every note with a new breath or bow stroke, whatever. On these gate-only synths, if you wanted the envelope to re-trigger every note, you had to play separate notes.
Thank you... so to JUST control notes via midi, it would be out of the Kenton and into each of the 3 VCOs?

Again, thank you for everything (and thanks to all the other folks as well)

Dave-- I believe you own an Arp 2600... would you say it is much better than an Odyssey or jsut different? Any downside of regrets with the Arp 2600?

Thanks!
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27th January 2010
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Yes CV out of the kenton (or any midi-cv) into one of the multiples on the left of the 2600 front panel and out of the other 3 multiples into each VCO.

I think of them as 2 different things. The 2600 has been my main workhorse for many years. So flexible and even when not being used a synth, it's being used as a processor of some sort. Amazing machine and very flexible.
The Odyssey is also MUCH more flexible than many think but I still use it mainly for more melodic stuff compared to the 2600 which I use for everything but a lot of the time percussive stuff or weirder sounds.
I guess the odyssey is a synth whereas the 2600 is more a production centre!
I have ZERO regrets about the 2600. I have owned and sold many synths including some nice big modulars and the one synth I would not ever consider selling is the 2600. I did say that about my Buchla but in the end I didn't use the Buchla as much and the 2600 is something that can be used all the time and in many different ways.
Of course it's hard to say whether it is what YOU want but I think you will get a lot of great stuff out of it.
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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Thank you Dave!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by dlmorley View Post
Yes CV out of the kenton (or any midi-cv) into one of the multiples on the left of the 2600 front panel and out of the other 3 multiples into each VCO.

I think of them as 2 different things. The 2600 has been my main workhorse for many years. So flexible and even when not being used a synth, it's being used as a processor of some sort. Amazing machine and very flexible.
The Odyssey is also MUCH more flexible than many think but I still use it mainly for more melodic stuff compared to the 2600 which I use for everything but a lot of the time percussive stuff or weirder sounds.
I guess the odyssey is a synth whereas the 2600 is more a production centre!
I have ZERO regrets about the 2600. I have owned and sold many synths including some nice big modulars and the one synth I would not ever consider selling is the 2600. I did say that about my Buchla but in the end I didn't use the Buchla as much and the 2600 is something that can be used all the time and in many different ways.
Of course it's hard to say whether it is what YOU want but I think you will get a lot of great stuff out of it.

Your experience is helping me quite a bit... I guess my only concern with the 2600 is that it "seems" that it is often used for exactly what you said, especially more FX stuff. I'd HOPED I could use it for more musical stuff, ie bass and sequence pulses, etc.

I assumed that it is equally capable of all that. And I assumed that it is capable (musically) of all the Odyssey is capable of, but perhaps greater flexibility.

Would that be safe to say?

Or, if I'm looking for that classic Arp pulse and bass sound... is the Odyssey actually better?

I guess my fear is that it is a lot of machine for R2D2 sounds!
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Audi Uh Oh View Post
Your experience is helping me quite a bit... I guess my only concern with the 2600 is that it "seems" that it is often used for exactly what you said, especially more FX stuff. I'd HOPED I could use it for more musical stuff, ie bass and sequence pulses, etc.

I assumed that it is equally capable of all that. And I assumed that it is capable (musically) of all the Odyssey is capable of, but perhaps greater flexibility.

Would that be safe to say?

Or, if I'm looking for that classic Arp pulse and bass sound... is the Odyssey actually better?

I guess my fear is that it is a lot of machine for R2D2 sounds!
The 2600 will do all you need. If you have both it is easier to get a straight ahead sound out of the odyssey as it is laid out that way but the 2600 does it no sweat and the rest!
Stuff I love doing. If you make a bass sound for example, route the output of the filter into the preamp and then route the preamp into the filter input of the VCA (which overrides the filter output if you see what I mean!). Some nice richness to be added there right up to monstrous drive.

Don't avoid the voltage processing section.

Use the Reverb to process voltages!

So much to be discovered on a 2600
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27th January 2010
Old 27th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlmorley View Post
The 2600 will do all you need. If you have both it is easier to get a straight ahead sound out of the odyssey as it is laid out that way but the 2600 does it no sweat and the rest!
Stuff I love doing. If you make a bass sound for example, route the output of the filter into the preamp and then route the preamp into the filter input of the VCA (which overrides the filter output if you see what I mean!). Some nice richness to be added there right up to monstrous drive.

Don't avoid the voltage processing section.

Use the Reverb to process voltages!

So much to be discovered on a 2600
You have been a fantastic help! Thank you for all your time

And while it seems too conveneint for me to say so now, I want to compliment you on the "Ghosts" album, which I have loved and been listening to heavily for over a year now. Brilliant work!!!

Again, thank you
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27th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Audi Uh Oh View Post
You have been a fantastic help! Thank you for all your time

And while it seems too conveneint for me to say so now, I want to compliment you on the "Ghosts" album, which I have loved and been listening to heavily for over a year now. Brilliant work!!!

Again, thank you

Many thanks!
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2nd November 2013
Old 2nd November 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlmorley View Post
Hi
Yes. If you want the filter to open as you move up the keyboard, one into the filter cv input and one for each VCO (of course it depends what you are doing!)
You can use the multiple on the front panel if you like. cv into one multiple jack and 3 minijacks out to each vco. It's just that there are only those 3 but it works to start with.
The cables I use are like this picture BUT mono jack and I have 3 of them chained.


[/I]
Hi Folks

Apologies for reviving such an old thread but im having trouble sourcing the cabling mentioned by Mr Morley in this post.

My 2600 arrives this week and i plan to use my Kenton Pro2 with it so the three way splitter mentioned would be perfect but im struggling to find them online and i have looked, i promise!

Found plenty of standard mono Y splitters but non with three or more.

Any info or link would be much appreciated?
#19
2nd November 2013
Old 2nd November 2013
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If you want to get several outputs from one CV it sounds like you need a buffered multiple - not merely a simple cable.
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2nd November 2013
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Many thanks for chiming in Yoozer,

Thats a term i've not come across before but will look into straight away.
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3rd November 2013
Old 3rd November 2013
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You don't need to split the CV. the 2600 has a master pitch bus.

-if you have a keyboard, make sure it's disconnected.

-run a single cable (pitch CV) into the jack labeled KBD CV OUTPUT, on the far left, just above the multiples. then as long as VCO 1/2/3 are switched to KBD ON, all three VCO's will track with no extra cabling needed. The VCF will track as well, unless you plug something into the VCF jack normaled to KBD CV, the one without a slider attached.

- run another cable (gate pulse) into the SH/GATE jack (below the AR envelope). you have to have enough voltage for this to trigger both AR and ADSR. I think somewhere between 5 and 10 volts is the threshold.
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4th November 2013
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Thats great info Cycad, many thanks!

I've still not took delivery of the thing yet so really looking forward to reading through the manual when it lands later this week and getting to grips with it...
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