jupiter 6 or andromeda

[murphythecat87]

well, its quite hard finding a A6, will the roland jupiter 6 could be an option

[SovietSpaceChild]

a n a l o g u e h a v e n

[murphythecat87]

3000$ new, nahhhh, i cant! i only have around 2000$

[Jay-]

you can get an A6 for $2000 used.

[murphythecat87]

where! goddammit

[Brickman]

Vintage Synth Explorer • View topic - ANDROMEDA, mbase11, ax7, minikorg, moog, arp, frostwave

[CfNorENa]

Nova Musik- The Electronic Musician's Wonderland.

[Diametro]

Originally Posted by murphythecat87

well, its quite hard finding a A6, will the roland jupiter 6 could be an option

What else do you have ... ??? And what are you looking for ... ???

There are many answers to this question ...

Mainly, you should go for what grabs you ... If you can't afford something, save up for it ... Or get it another time ...

While Andy may have more features and poly, it sounds less "analog" to me with less "character," is far less attractive aesthetically, costs more, does not match JP-6 on all fronts (in fact, may not nail any of JP-6 key areas even if some/most are esoteric) as well as differences in UI philosophy (JP-6 has NO menus, not even a display and it works perfectly) ...

That said, Andy will probably end up in my studio (even if it does not feature good VEGAS MODE and says ALESIS on back) ... But with JP-8 and JP-6 on hand, it could be a while ...

[Jay-]

Originally Posted by murphythecat87

where! goddammit

Just have the money and watch ebay or CL.
I never said it would be a quick find but save your self lots of cash.

Iv watched 4X on ebay all sell and two local and I dont have the cash.

[SovietSpaceChild]

Originally Posted by Diametro

While Andy may have more features and poly, it sounds less "analog" to me with less "character,"

Wat? Your definition of what constitutes sounding "analog" having "character" is drastically different from mine, and could vary wildly from the tastes of the OP

[Odey]

Originally Posted by murphythecat87

well, its quite hard finding a A6, will the roland jupiter 6 could be an option

I was pretty much in your situation when I decided I liked the vintage analogue sound.

Best thing you can do is be patient. Put a few poly synths on your wish list and when they come up in your area at the right price then go for them. Patience is definitely the key. I wanted a prophet 5 first but I spotted a second hand Andromeda first and it was local and at the right price. Second hand at £1200.. Obviously in dollars thats quite a bit more but locally in £'s that is quite good. So I bought it and I love it. My point being that its all about timing and patience. I have just snagged a Prophet 5. But I waited for a year until one popped up that I wanted.

Now I have an Andy and a Prophet 5.. I couldn't be happier...

[Diametro]

Originally Posted by SovietSpaceChild

Wat? Your definition of what constitutes sounding "analog" having "character" is drastically different from mine, and could vary wildly from the tastes of the OP

Not only is that implied in that kind of statement, I explicitly express that when I when I write "to me."

Of course, the slutty answer: BOTH ... !!!

However, part of my reluctance toward Andy is its jack of all trades approach to analog sound ... A bit generic, imo ... Whereas to me JP-6 has a more unique sound, very aggressive, screaming high end with great filters ... I can't imagine doing high-pitched sounds with any other synth really ... (and when you think of it, there's quite a bit of sonic territory there ... )

Pads on JP-6 ... ??? Not really ... Even Juno-60 is much smoother, organic ...
Basses? Maybe not ... (but it can do some big things) ...
Leads? Of course ...
Sweeps, bleeps and plink plink noice ... Dynamite !!!

Maybe it's not as good of a first analog as Andy but I don't think it would disappoint either ... Esp. getting a nice reverb to go with it as it can sound particularly dry (which is part of its charm, imo ... )

[Odey]

Originally Posted by Diametro

Not only is that implied in that kind of statement, I explicitly express that when I when I write "to me."

Of course, the slutty answer: BOTH ... !!!

However, part of my reluctance toward Andy is its jack of all trades approach to analog sound ... A bit generic, imo ... Whereas to me JP-6 has a more unique sound, very aggressive, screaming high end with great filters ... I can't imagine doing high-pitched sounds with any other synth really ... (and when you think of it, there's quite a bit of sonic territory there ... )

Pads on JP-6 ... ??? Not really ... Even Juno-60 is much smoother, organic ...
Basses? Maybe not ... (but it can do some big things) ...
Leads? Of course ...
Sweeps and bleeps and bloops ... Dynamite !!!

Maybe it's not as good of a first analog as Andy but I don't think it would disappoint either ... Esp. getting a nice reverb to go with it as it can sound particularly dry (which is part of its charm, imo ... )

Well, problem is that pads are not very cool. Especially if you make ambient music. Isn't that right Diametro?

To the Op.. I love pads...

[Diametro]

Originally Posted by Odey

Well, problem is that pads are not very cool. Especially if you make ambient music. Isn't that right Diametro?

If pads are high on your list, and you have no other recourse, maybe JP6 isn't best choice (I tend not to use pads much, thinking they tend to turn tracks to mush) ... BUT ... I'm sure there are others out there who do get nice pads with Jupiter-6 ... Ny first problem is I always run it dry ... I haven't purchased a dedicated hardware reverb for it yet ...

[SovietSpaceChild]

Originally Posted by Diametro

However, part of my reluctance toward Andy is its jack of all trades approach to analog sound ... A bit generic, imo ... Whereas to me JP-6 has a more unique sound, very aggressive, screaming high end with great filters ... I can't imagine doing high-pitched sounds with any other synth really ... (and when you think of it, there's quite a bit of sonic territory there ... )

I don't really agree that the A6 is intended to be a jack of all trades, nor do I agree that it's generic. It definitely has an "American" sound, due wholly in part of decisions made at Alesis to use oscillators based on the Moog Modular design, as well as a Moog Modular and Oberheim SEM filter pairing. To people who grew up on listening to prog rock, this could be considered "generic", I guess. Even then, it really has a sound of its own. I have both an Andromeda and an Omega in the same room, and they're pretty easily discernible due to differences in character, where the Andromeda sounds very "wet" and "saturated", and the Omega sounds very crisp and well defined. Maybe it's a 70's vs. 80's thing when it comes to design philosophy? The Omega is, afterall, a polyphonic version of the SE ATC-X, which itself is based on the Moog Source.

Small bit of trivia, in the early design phase of the Andromeda, some Alesis engineers amassed all sorts of analog synths in order to see which parts they liked the best. In an alternate universe, Alesis may have released an analog poly synth based on the Jupiter 8. Aside from using Moog and Oberheim inspired designs in the signal patch, the Andromeda takes a couple of design cues form the Yamaha CS-80, mainly in the form of the ribbon controller and the post filter oscillator mixer.

[Oli]

The issue with the A6's character is not with the circuit design, but the implementation. The IC process used, does not achieve anything like the dynamic range or non linear effects of the circuits the design is based on. This has been explained by members of the design team.

I suspect they used a more modern process, due to the state of the industry at the time. I'm not aware of current VLSIC processes which implement circuits in a similar fashion to vintage synths. This is a significant part of the design, and not easily revisited.

The prototype has been described as having a much more vintage character, very similar to the circuits the design was based on.

IMO, the A6 implementation is a slight let down for an ambitious and very well featured synth.

[kilon]

Originally Posted by Odey

Well, problem is that pads are not very cool. Especially if you make ambient music. Isn't that right Diametro?

To the Op.. I love pads...

Is that a joke ?



Anyway, the way I see it, sure Jupiter 6 is the easiest of the two , to milk it lush and warm sounds.... but nothing can beat a real galaxy of opportunities that Andromeda is.

If you are extremely demanding from your sounds, get an Andromeda, if vintage sound is your goal then get a Jupiter. Its pretty much straightforward.

I own an Andromeda, and I would not pass an opportunity to own Jupiter if I could spare the money.

If you go for Andromeda, a warning though, be prepared to be very annoyed, this synth does not like people who want it easy... me included... lol .... oh well... you cant have an omelet without breaking some eggs.

[Odey]

Originally Posted by kilon

Is that a joke ?



Anyway, the way I see it, sure Jupiter 6 is the easiest of the two , to milk it lush and warm sounds.... but nothing can beat a real galaxy of opportunities that Andromeda is.

If you are extremely demanding from your sounds, get an Andromeda, if vintage sound is your goal then get a Jupiter. Its pretty much straightforward.

I own an Andromeda, and I would not pass an opportunity to own Jupiter if I could spare the money.

If you go for Andromeda, a warning though, be prepared to be very annoyed, this synth does not like people who want it easy... me included... lol .... oh well... you cant have an omelet without breaking some eggs.

Yes.. Its definitely a joke...

Whats annoying you about the Andy?.. I love how it sounds but the programming is a bit tedious for me and the screen is a bit workstation like...

[flat earth]

Given the choice between the two, i'd go for the Andromeda. The possabilities + reliability + American charactor would appeal to me more. Thats not to say the JP6 is a bad choice, far from it in fact, but its one of the few older boards about that doesn't tick all the boxes on what most people are expecting from a vintage poly, (ie warm, rich encompassing sound). Imo, its the perfect poly to compliment another. I don't think I could have a JP6 as my only vintage piece for example.

An Andromeda + JP6 would be a great pairing imo.

[kilon]

Originally Posted by Odey

Yes.. Its definitely a joke...

Whats annoying you about the Andy?.. I love how it sounds but the programming is a bit tedious for me and the screen is a bit workstation like...

impossible to tame its sound, it always sounds the opposite i expect to sound.... very weird synth!!!

[Don Solaris]

Andromeda does sound analog. But there's no much coloring of the sound which sometimes annoys me. I guess that's what you get from SMD design.

For one thing it surprises me (being analog poly) is the BASS this thing is able to pull out. Single Osc bass with a touch of Sub can shake down the house. Pads are fantastic, very airy (in 12dB mode). Damn i should post some demos... Very good synth once you get used to its UI.

[OurDarkness]

Originally Posted by Don Solaris

For one thing it surprises me (being analog poly) is the BASS this thing is able to pull out. Single Osc bass with a touch of Sub can shake down the house. Pads are fantastic, very airy (in 12dB mode). Damn i should post some demos... Very good synth once you get used to its UI.

This is precisely my thought about the bass too. In fact I have found it a bit difficult to get boths VCO to detune properly in order to make certain bass sounds. I know it sounds weird because there is provision for tune, coarse tune, ultra-fine tune and of course there is hard and soft sync to make the detuning behave properly. But somehow the detuning mostly lends itself to pads, not basses.

So for basses I was very surprised, like Don, that a lot of mono-patches are just freaking huge - no need to dial the second VCO at all. Or even set it at a sine wave and add litlle amounts just to boost the fundamental.

Oh, and when I say freaking huge, I mean huge as in HUGE

[OurDarkness]

What annoys me a little about the SEM filter is that there must be a weird thing going about the resonance, is that up to something like 85% of its range there is not much going on, and past that 85% (of the resonance range) it starts to accumulate very quickly. Makes it difficult to predict the modulation in this one, because if you have an LFO and you modulate the cutoff inversely with the resonance at 85% nothing happens unless some drastic modulation is applied. It can get tricky to adjust, if someone manages to get it right it sounds beautiful but it's easy to loose the sweet spot.

I don't know if the original SEM behaved this way. I have read someplace that the first VCF has a weird behaviour with regard to feedback, which is to be expected given the resonace weirdness, so maybe it's something to do with the design of the ASIC.

[kpatz]

Here's a couple ambient pad patches I created on my Andy a few months ago:

Arppy Pad
AnotherVangelis

[OurDarkness]

Originally Posted by kpatz

Here's a couple ambient pad patches I created on my Andy a few months ago:

Arppy Pad
AnotherVangelis

Lovely stuff!thumbsup Especially the Arppy pad.

[NWSooner]

Check out Ypsilon Vector on MySpace, his stuff is almost entirely Andromeda. Listen to Ash Like Snow especially.

Ypsilon Vector on MySpace Music - Free Streaming MP3s, Pictures & Music Videos

[clusterchord]

most have already been said about the two, but i'd like to add that whether JP-6 or A6 sound more "analog" or not, really depends on the sound you want out of them.

one some type of sounds JP-6 is definetely more analog, liquid, pure. i largely agree with Diametro's assement on high pitched sounds, blinks blonks, leads mmmmm but most of all PWM sweeps pads... that is Roland's territory. A6 cannot compare.

an then on some other sounds JP6 not up to par at all i.e. pads. unless youre going for buzzy high strings. whereas A6 is all about organic and warm pads, esp 12dB/oct. in general sounds big with bass, moog-ish bass/lead etc. fuzzy/dirty stuff is great too. being complex and having tons a features goes without saying, tho i find that secondary to the baisc sound character. which is unique without a doubt.


indeed very complementary boards. focused/cutting/pure/open sound vs. organic/fuzzy/smeared/warm/

my 0.02


ps here's a recent noodling on Andremeda's two filters.. 12dB is doin the main sweep, the 24dB is brought in at mix level and is in self oscillation:

A6-ThickPad-SelfOscillation.mp3





.

[Beermaster]

I'd Definately would go for Andy over JP6 - several reasons:

Multitimbral,

Modulation options

FX - ok not the best but bung a bit of delay etc and sounds even better

Ribbon Controller

Some of my Fav pads come from the Andy

Sequencer + complexed Arpegiator

MIDI locked LFOs

Separate outs

MIDI CC of most of the front panel controls

A huge comunity

[kpatz]

Originally Posted by OurDarkness

What annoys me a little about the SEM filter is that there must be a weird thing going about the resonance, is that up to something like 85% of its range there is not much going on, and past that 85% (of the resonance range) it starts to accumulate very quickly.

What's funny about the Filter 1 resonance knob is it appears to have an exponential, or reverse logarithmic mapping to it. Watch the display while slowly turning it, you'll see the bar goes up faster toward the upper end of the knob's travel. Come to think of it, I think filter 2's resonance knob works the same way. There must be a reason behind it.

Maybe try using the soft knobs to set resonance, as those have a linear response.

Originally Posted by clusterchord

ps here's a recent noodling on Andremeda's two filters.. 12dB is doin the main sweep, the 24dB is brought in at mix level and is in self oscillation:

A6-ThickPad-SelfOscillation.mp3

I like it! With filter 1 down low it sounds very Oberheim-ish. Nice BPF sweep too.

What were you modulating filter 2 with? A noise LFO?

I wish I had more time to twiddle with mine. It takes time to get good sounds out of it, but boy does it sound great when I do.

[author]

I don't think I have ever heard anything prettier than a Jupiter 6.

Except perhaps an a6.

Sigh.