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Phaser recommendation for analog synth
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huima
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#1
7th September 2009
Old 7th September 2009
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Phaser recommendation for analog synth

I'm searching for a phaser mainly for analog pads (french house style). I've got Juno 60 and getting DSI tetra soon. Been thinking of Moogerfooger and Vermona...
Stereo out is a must.
Hopefully someone could help me out.

peace.
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7th September 2009
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Man, I was on an endless quest for the Nick Rhodes phaser and tried MXR Phase 90, MXR Phase 100, EH Small Stone, and the BOSS PH-3. None of them had the sound I wanted. The only ones left to try are the Moog and Vermona... a friend has the Vermona and said it's amazing. Let me know how you get on as I'm curious... Nick used the old Roland rackmount phasers back in the day, but these are very hard to come by and ridiculously expensive when they do.
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7th September 2009
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Check out Small Stone first
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7th September 2009
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+1 on the mooger but the tone is dark. It also seems to boost bass a bit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by huima View Post
I'm searching for a phaser mainly for analog pads (french house style). I've got Juno 60 and getting DSI tetra soon. Been thinking of Moogerfooger and Vermona...
Stereo out is a must.
Hopefully someone could help me out.

peace.
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7th September 2009
Old 7th September 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djpablo View Post
Man, I was on an endless quest for the Nick Rhodes phaser and tried MXR Phase 90, MXR Phase 100, EH Small Stone, and the BOSS PH-3. None of them had the sound I wanted. The only ones left to try are the Moog and Vermona... a friend has the Vermona and said it's amazing. Let me know how you get on as I'm curious... Nick used the old Roland rackmount phasers back in the day, but these are very hard to come by and ridiculously expensive when they do.
if you are thinking of synth lines, this wasn't a phaser at all, and that may be a reason why you can't find one sounding like that. synth lines (like JP4 on careless memories, planet earth intro etc) went thru an old MXR Flanger vertical rack unit. can't find the picture right now. closest in sound to this unit is MXR 2U flanger/doubler:



anyway this is coming direct from Nick Rhodes. i was the opening act for their concert over here in 2001, so we talked for a while, about his jp8, new wave, 80s and among other things, i asked him the very same question: "what gd dmn phaser is that.."

however, he did use phaser on Crumar String Machine. i played a Crumar Multiman, and its enough to put an old Small Stone on it - its dead-on accurate. i also own the moog, and it works fantastic too. i use it on Solina and OBXa very often. slightly darker, deeper. but imho Small Stone is the actual sound of DD strings. theyre quite cheap too.


its true the MXR rack unit commands high prices. i love this flanging sound, so i was thinking of trying the vintage MXR117 pedal, it's from the same era, to see i'd there is any kinship in sound to the larger units.. its a fraction of the cost.
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7th September 2009
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Actually, I own the MXR Flanger/Doubler and the newer-generation 117 pedal. And the flanger is dead-on to the Nick Rhodes sound, but it's not that phasing he uses on high string leads. That was the Roland phaser (according to Nick himself). But as for the flanger, I can say that the pedal (which can be had new) sounds just as good as the 2U rack piece I have so you'd be just fine with that.
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7th September 2009
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Ensoniq DP4 has a great french house phaser...
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7th September 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djpablo View Post
Actually, I own the MXR Flanger/Doubler and the newer-generation 117 pedal. And the flanger is dead-on to the Nick Rhodes sound, but it's not that phasing he uses on high string leads. That was the Roland phaser (according to Nick himself). But as for the flanger, I can say that the pedal (which can be had new) sounds just as good as the 2U rack piece I have so you'd be just fine with that.

ah ok, that's interesting.. so youre saying its not worth throwin the cash on the rack version of flanger ? they ask as much as 400 bucks nowadays, i was sorta considering it... but i'd rather save my money..

PS, how is the 117 doing with synth signal levels? any distortion? do you need to turn down the synth?


iirc the Roland SHP323 is capable of 4/8 stage phasing.. you could try the Vermona as it can do that as well. but im not sure about the design. probably different hardware. tho the string sound on the albums sounds to me like 4-stage.. when i use the 12-stage setting on moog, it really swirls and whistles, like harmonica.. its a special sound, not your typical phasing. little overbearing for"classic" use. be it as it may, i'm very happy with the sound of vintage Small Stone, which (i did A/B) is different and deeper than the EHX 90s/00s re-issue.




edit: here's moog on 6-stage setting, on my ex-MKS80: http://www.babic.com/SYN/MKS80-V4/MK...Mod-Phaser.mp3

and moog on 12-stage setting on my Solina: http://www.babic.com/SYN/SOLINA/Soli...3_12-stage.mp3
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7th September 2009
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MuTron II
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[QUOTE=clusterchord;4552363]ah ok, that's interesting.. so youre saying its not worth throwin the cash on the rack version of flanger ? they ask as much as 400 bucks nowadays, i was sorta considering it... but i'd rather save my money..

PS, how is the 117 doing with synth signal levels? any distortion? do you need to turn down the synth?



No, I would not spend the extra $ on the rack unit. To me the pedal sounds as good. But yes, you do have to turn down the synth to avoid distorting with the pedal, whereas the rack can handle the line-level input from a keyboard just fine. I got my Flanger/Doubler for $300 on eBay in pretty good condition FWIW.
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By the way... the Moog phaser sounds really nice and spacey... definitely like Morder or something, but too harsh/resonant for the Nick Rhodes sound on strings... his is more of a really slow, mellow phase where the depth isn't so pronounced. That's why I didn't like the Small Stone because the slope of the phase really jumps quickly at each end of the spectrum and wasn't a smooth fade between both poles. I have yet to find one i like...
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Not stereo, but the creamiest most organic bubbly phaser I've ever used is the Maestro (Oberheim) PS-1. Simple to use with 3 presets slow,medium, and fast. And switching from each is not instant, it ramps up to speed, they were trying to imitate a leslie. Serious mojo on any track. I like it much better than the Bi-phase and it is definitely in that league sonically.

Here's a good page on the effect:
Maestro PS-1A Phase Shifter

My other favorite is the Mutronics Phaser (not the II), again very organic.
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7th September 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barfunkel View Post
Ensoniq DP4 has a great french house phaser...
second that! - really distinctive and big sounding, and the flanger's great too.
huima
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7th September 2009
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Thanks for the recommendations.
Forgot to mention that I tried small stone(nano and normal) some time ago and didn't like it that much.
Ensoniq might be interesting...
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7th September 2009
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i think the moogerfooger phaser sounds beautiful.
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7th September 2009
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The Mooger Fooger version of the 12 stage phaser may sound good but its still not quite the daddy that the original Moog Rack 12 stage Phaser - with optional selection of number of phased stages and number of resonated stages etc etc

Small Stone is Creamy and jean Michel Jarre

So many choices

Beer.
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10th October 2009
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11th October 2009
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[QUOTE=djpablo;4552448]
Quote:
Originally Posted by clusterchord View Post
ah ok, that's interesting.. so youre saying its not worth throwin the cash on the rack version of flanger ? they ask as much as 400 bucks nowadays, i was sorta considering it... but i'd rather save my money..

PS, how is the 117 doing with synth signal levels? any distortion? do you need to turn down the synth?



No, I would not spend the extra $ on the rack unit. To me the pedal sounds as good. But yes, you do have to turn down the synth to avoid distorting with the pedal, whereas the rack can handle the line-level input from a keyboard just fine. I got my Flanger/Doubler for $300 on eBay in pretty good condition FWIW.

well, for flanging duties, i finally decided to go with a clone of original, late70s ADA flanger. bought the original SAD1024 bbd's already. i've found a boutique pedal tech locally who will buid it. it will feature dual mono/stereo operation, synth and guitar level/impedance switch w JFETs, expression pedal inputs. dual or single master controls, in a 1U rack with separate TB switches on floor





which reminds me, if you really want a SHP323, wihtout paying the outrageous going prices, i think your best bet is to download the service manual and schematics, and have someone make you a clone, if all the parts are still available. and for a phaser, i dont see why not. most stuff is still arround. no rare bbd's inside.



also, ive found a few AP-2 Roland Phase II pedals from mid/late 70s. they are 4 stage like one of the settings on 323, which was likely used by NR. probably same or very similar circuits. perhaps you can try that.

ive seen two for sale at Studio1525 - Vintage Music Store for arround 250.


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11th October 2009
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+2 on the DP4. i just picked one up a few months agoand it is the OBVIOUS french house choice.

I also use old digitech and DOD pedals. They made a lot of really amazing sounding and under used phase, flange, delay etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barfunkel View Post
Ensoniq DP4 has a great french house phaser...
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11th October 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peglegjoe857 View Post
+2 on the DP4. i just picked one up a few months agoand it is the OBVIOUS french house choice.
+3 on the DP4.

If it's got a phaser algorithm anything like the ASR-10 - and it does - it'd be almost worth buying just for that. Putting any kind of string sound through the ASR-10's phaser instantly evoked vintage Mellotron / String Machine city.

Why, oh why, did I sell my ASR-10?

Oh, right, because once it was in its Anvil-style case, it was damn near 100 pounds, and after lugging it several blockst to the car en route to a gig when I lived downtown and only had street parking, I had a "that's the last straw...F this!" moment, and got a lightweight controller.

But that phaser...
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Someones building the phaser unit out of the Arp Quadra....i'd be all over that if I didnt have a Quadra myself...
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11th October 2009
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The Boss SE-70 is worth a look, and it's got some nice plate verbs that would work well with analog.
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12th October 2009
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My favorite phaser for blow-up larger-than-life stereo phasing is the Schulte Compact Phasing "A". The best thing about it is the way it starts when you push the "on" foot switch: it sounds a bit like a Leslie starting to spin, but it increases the phasing effect rather than the speed. Hard to describe, but absolutely incredible.
Another great feature is that you can set the frequency range the phasing is happening and leave the rest of the spectrum unprocessed.

These babies have turned quite expensive even in Germany - good look finding one!
I have heard someone is building clones or offering kits or schematics or whatever.

Cheers,
Bert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feinstrom View Post
My favorite phaser for blow-up larger-than-life stereo phasing is the Schulte Compact Phasing "A". The best thing about it is the way it starts when you push the "on" foot switch: it sounds a bit like a Leslie starting to spin, but it increases the phasing effect rather than the speed. Hard to describe, but absolutely incredible.
Another great feature is that you can set the frequency range the phasing is happening and leave the rest of the spectrum unprocessed.

These babies have turned quite expensive even in Germany - good look finding one!
I have heard someone is building clones or offering kits or schematics or whatever.

Cheers,
Bert
Look here: JH. Compact Clone if you fancy the DIY route.
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Maxon phasers?

Has anyone tried the Maxon phasers? How do they sound, compared to Small Stone, Moog, or the MXR Phase 90?
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12th October 2009
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Next resonator

I have one of these. it is great for phasing strings etc...

From a review I did not write on HC:

"absoulutely awesome phasing effects in glorious stereo, i'd totally recommend it for psychedelic, ambient, film music etc. a secret weapon- few people seem to know about this, and they are to be had cheap-ish.
i make experimental music with some of the finest analogue synthesisers ever produced (roland jupiters / yamaha cs-60, -50, -30 / moog and find the sound qaulity of this unit absolutely outstanding.
please suppot this little known german brand despite their lame website and less-than-sexy advertisment campaigns.
they've got it where it counts: building excellent, musical gear for very reasonable prices."

Uh yeah.. what he said...
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13th October 2009
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13th October 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by choice_of_meat View Post
I have one of these. it is great for phasing strings etc...

From a review I did not write on HC:

"absoulutely awesome phasing effects in glorious stereo, i'd totally recommend it for psychedelic, ambient, film music etc. a secret weapon- few people seem to know about this, and they are to be had cheap-ish.
i make experimental music with some of the finest analogue synthesisers ever produced (roland jupiters / yamaha cs-60, -50, -30 / moog and find the sound qaulity of this unit absolutely outstanding.
please suppot this little known german brand despite their lame website and less-than-sexy advertisment campaigns.
they've got it where it counts: building excellent, musical gear for very reasonable prices."

Uh yeah.. what he said...
Could you do an audio example? I'd love to hear this thing!
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13th October 2009
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14th October 2009
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I have a Moogerfooger and a Phase 90, both of which are pretty well known...but the other one I have that gets a bunch of use is the Electro Harmonix Stereo Poly Phase. Nasty little toy...



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