Cubase 5, Motif XS and Mlan

jdieks · 4th July 2009

hi, i want to get a motif rack xs, but one thing is not really clear to me about the intergration in cubase.

what i hope is that you can connect the motif, using mlan/firewire, to your computer and then use the editor as if it was a vst plugin with the audio comming out of the editor in the mixer...

but what i hope not is that you have to select the motif as the asio interface and then you can route audio back and forth as if it was a soundcard BUT not beeing able to use your normal soundcard's inputs and outputs...

could someone clear this up for me? if it's the second option there's no need for me to get the mlan option and i'll just connect it to my inputs of my soundcard and make it an external instrument, as usual..

thanks for the help...

tribeofenki · 5th July 2009

mLan is a protocol that is similar to network LAN, but is specific for music. This ugly s**t is developed by Yamaha. To use mLan and get, let's say, 16 channels audio and midi or whatever, you must use mLan enabled cards.Try to get a 2nd hand i88x rack on the net...

pyvnd · 5th July 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdieks

hi, i want to get a motif rack xs, but one thing is not really clear to me about the intergration in cubase.

what i hope is that you can connect the motif, using mlan/firewire, to your computer and then use the editor as if it was a vst plugin with the audio comming out of the editor in the mixer...

but what i hope not is that you have to select the motif as the asio interface and then you can route audio back and forth as if it was a soundcard BUT not beeing able to use your normal soundcard's inputs and outputs...

could someone clear this up for me? if it's the second option there's no need for me to get the mlan option and i'll just connect it to my inputs of my soundcard and make it an external instrument, as usual..

thanks for the help...

I'm pretty sure if you get the mLan option installed then it all just travels through the firewire right into Cubase 5. And it's integrated as VST3. That would be the whole point of installing the mLan and using Cubase 5, although I think you can do this with any VST host. Peace. If you look on the yamahasynth.com it will explain it all to you. mLan is nice and solid once you get it working. I run two i88x in unison for 20 audio channels and it works fine. Only limited by your PC's power.

jdieks · 5th July 2009

i had a response from a guy from yamaha on motifator.com also. i hoped it would work the virus TI/powercore/ any dsp device way... but it does not..

when you connect it to mlan it's basically just an audio interface where you can stream a couple of audio tracks to the device and it gives you a couple of inputs where it streams audio itself.. but to do this it must be made your asio device, so you can't use any of your other outboard gear while using the motif..

a pretty lame implementation if you ask me... so now i'm not sure if i should get the motif or the roland xv5080 anymore, if i just want good sounds to replace 60% of the sample libraries that take huge amounts of ram and take ages to load... and a lot of times arn't even THAT good..

DevonB · 5th July 2009

MLan also takes CPU on your DAW to work too. I saw this on the Yamaha 01x. Don't know if this is any better today or not, but certainly took a healthy chunk of my CPU back in 2004 when I reviewed it. Yamaha said they were going to reduce the polling interval to reduce CPU overhead. I'd really like to hear from someone who's using MLan today. It took 15-20% of my CPU on a 2.53Ghz Intel and a 2.8Ghz Intel back in 2004. It was literally select the device to use and I'd have load on my processor, switch it to something else, processor load went away.

Can anyone comment?

Devon

jdieks · 5th July 2009

i just find it strange that yamaha keeps comming with all this stuff that could be really great, but often just lack the things you REALLY want in a studio situation..

studio connections, while beeing really handy for intergrating your studio into cubase, lacks automation.
and the firewire connection on the motifs, which promises total intergration, give you intergration with the computer, but none at all with the rest of the studio..

besides that i just noticed that the motif only has 2 stereo outs..

i don't get it..

i just read the korg m-3 does have properer cubase intergration, i didn't know that.

but you read everywhere that it gives you 6 outputs into cubase. doesn anyone know if these are 6 mono (3 stereo) or 6 stereo outputs?

pyvnd · 5th July 2009

If I were buying a workstation hardware thing I'd go for the M3 all the way. I think the module only option costs more than the Yamaha but you get so much more. I was a Yamaha fan in the older days but I've given up now. Of the three big Japanese companies I think Korg is the best.

jdieks · 5th July 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by pyvnd

If I were buying a workstation hardware thing I'd go for the M3 all the way. I think the module only option costs more than the Yamaha but you get so much more. I was a Yamaha fan in the older days but I've given up now. Of the three big Japanese companies I think Korg is the best.

yeah... that's what i'm thinking now too... now i just want to know how well they did the firewire intergration thing.. they claim it gives you "6 outputs" in your DAW..

yamaha claimed 4 (real) outputs for the motif. turned out to be the usual main and aux... so just 2 really

(4 mono... but why would you need all those insert effects etc on the motif if you use it mono )

i hope korg means 6 stereo outputs and not 6 mono..

jdieks · 5th July 2009

i'm reading the manual of the firewire kit... it's 6 mono, so that's a pitty... but besides that i don't really see any negative points in the m3.. i think i might get one of those then

DevonB · 8th July 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by pyvnd

If I were buying a workstation hardware thing I'd go for the M3 all the way. I think the module only option costs more than the Yamaha but you get so much more. I was a Yamaha fan in the older days but I've given up now. Of the three big Japanese companies I think Korg is the best.

It's all opinion, of course, but I feel Roland is the best all-around, then Yamaha then Korg for natural stuff, BUT, Korg is the best for straight up 'synthesis' stuff, then Roland then Yamaha.

The M3 hasn't impressed me whatsoever. The KARMA 2 is used as a glorified drum machine on the M3. A pity really. I was hoping for MUCH more creative and musically useful patches. All the great synthetic wonderfully moving patches on the M3 had KARMA turned OFF, which I found amusing. Granted, I've only played with it for a few hours. I have the KARMA 1.0 software on my PC for my Triton rack. I think the orignal patches are better, strangly enough.

Devon

JorgV · 8th July 2009

I have a Motif XS, and Cubase 5, with no mlan.

But, Yamaha has a VST-editor out for the XS, which makes it work in just the way you described.

The editor loads as an 'external instrument' in Cubase. It 'hijacks' one input-pair from your audio interface to handle the audio: the XS becomes a multichannel VSTi. Ofcourse you have to have USB and stereo audio connected for this to work, but then it works just as easy as any multitimbral VSTi. Once set up correctly (read the readme!), it just a matter of selecting the MotifXS in the VSTi bay, and off you go.

[not sure about this bit:]
From how I see it, the 'only' benifit of mLan is that you'll get all your MIDI-channels as seperate audio streams (16 stereo inputs). But the mLan driver is an ASIO driver, so you can't use your own audio-interface anymore.

4th July 2009	#1
jdieks Gear nut Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 102 Thread Starter	Cubase 5, Motif XS and Mlan hi, i want to get a motif rack xs, but one thing is not really clear to me about the intergration in cubase. what i hope is that you can connect the motif, using mlan/firewire, to your computer and then use the editor as if it was a vst plugin with the audio comming out of the editor in the mixer... but what i hope not is that you have to select the motif as the asio interface and then you can route audio back and forth as if it was a soundcard BUT not beeing able to use your normal soundcard's inputs and outputs... could someone clear this up for me? if it's the second option there's no need for me to get the mlan option and i'll just connect it to my inputs of my soundcard and make it an external instrument, as usual.. thanks for the help...

5th July 2009	#2
tribeofenki Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: @$tr@L pL@n3 Posts: 1,511	mLan is a protocol that is similar to network LAN, but is specific for music. This ugly s**t is developed by Yamaha. To use mLan and get, let's say, 16 channels audio and midi or whatever, you must use mLan enabled cards.Try to get a 2nd hand i88x rack on the net... __________________ Ishkur Guide to Electronica ૐ Where are all the Goa parties?

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5th July 2009	#5
DevonB Gear addict Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: USA Posts: 447	MLan also takes CPU on your DAW to work too. I saw this on the Yamaha 01x. Don't know if this is any better today or not, but certainly took a healthy chunk of my CPU back in 2004 when I reviewed it. Yamaha said they were going to reduce the polling interval to reduce CPU overhead. I'd really like to hear from someone who's using MLan today. It took 15-20% of my CPU on a 2.53Ghz Intel and a 2.8Ghz Intel back in 2004. It was literally select the device to use and I'd have load on my processor, switch it to something else, processor load went away. Can anyone comment? Devon

5th July 2009	#7
pyvnd Lives for gear Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 574	If I were buying a workstation hardware thing I'd go for the M3 all the way. I think the module only option costs more than the Yamaha but you get so much more. I was a Yamaha fan in the older days but I've given up now. Of the three big Japanese companies I think Korg is the best.

8th July 2009	#11
JorgV Gear nut Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 87	I have a Motif XS, and Cubase 5, with no mlan. But, Yamaha has a VST-editor out for the XS, which makes it work in just the way you described. The editor loads as an 'external instrument' in Cubase. It 'hijacks' one input-pair from your audio interface to handle the audio: the XS becomes a multichannel VSTi. Ofcourse you have to have USB and stereo audio connected for this to work, but then it works just as easy as any multitimbral VSTi. Once set up correctly (read the readme!), it just a matter of selecting the MotifXS in the VSTi bay, and off you go. [not sure about this bit:] From how I see it, the 'only' benifit of mLan is that you'll get all your MIDI-channels as seperate audio streams (16 stereo inputs). But the mLan driver is an ASIO driver, so you can't use your own audio-interface anymore.