Synth ? Beginner... Hard choices

[elz]

i have the micro x which a smaller version of the x5o and i think its fantastic.(it has a headphone skt)
personally id choose it over the SH-201 in your situation as the later is an analogue style synth which isnt really a suitable synth to learn on IMO.


cheers

[Martin Dubka]

I think if you want to learn/play synth (as opposed to just keys) you need something that you can edit easily with plenty of controls.

I'm a little biased because I'm not really a fan of virtual analogue's but I would recommend something like the Korg MS-2000 over the X50.

The SH-201 looks okay but I would save some money and pick up a used MS-2000 to see if it suits you.

[shadowfac]

I'd get the X50 first. Actually, I wouldn't ever get the 201. I tried it in a store and didn't like its sound. The SH-201 is an analog emulation synth, so it wouldn't be useful for realistic sounds like piano, acoustic drums, guitar, etc, and somehow I think the X50 may be even better for analog sounds than the 201. The X50 has the Triton engine, which was Korg's flagship synth ten years ago, but is still widely used.

With the X50 you'll get much more voices and polyphony, which means you'll be able to sequence full songs with it. I believe it comes with a VST editor so it should be relatively easy to edit preset patches or make your own.

Keep one thing in mind, though. I've read several times that the smaller Korg microX comes with a better sound set than the X50, even if both have the same synth engine.

My first synth was a Korg X5D, an older model similar to the X50. I wish I hadn't sold it and have been considering buying another one (or an microX) ever since, even though I don't really need it.

[gotpop]

The music you mention prominently features analog synths (real and/or virtual), and so that's the kind of synth you should probably look at.

I think it's worthwhile to learn to program your own sounds (and a lot of fun, too).

If you're an absolute absolute beginner, you could make your initial forays with a virtual analog synth plug-in, some of which are great sounding, and some of which are inexpensive or even free.

As far as hardware synths go, I'd recommend trying to find a used Nord Lead 2 (or a Nord Lead 2X if the price is right). They're dead simple to program (no menus), sound amazing, and they're bright red! They don't have any sort of internal effects, but unlike most modeling synths, the Nord synths don't really need them to sound good.

[pyvnd]

For me, when faced with a choice between Korg and Roland, go with Korg 95% of the time. If you're going to get a X50, why not just go all the way and get the M50? It seems to have so much going for it.

[Mateusz]

M50 ? Not this price range...

Anyway, thanks for all responses

The problem with stuff like X50 or Juno DM is that I might get bored after a time with patches... even though there is loads of them but not too much options for modulation

I conconsidered also Roland Juno D Limited Edition, but since its price grown... it's less of good value

With VA you can get loads of possibilities, turn your knobs whenever you want and create own sound from scratch

I was curious about the programming, I'm not afraid of trying it, I think it might give many inspirastions since you build what you want to get

Is it anyway similar to computer programming, in college we do Delphi, so I though self fact of doing something what relates to programming, might be helpful, at least a bit

[gotpop]

With VA you can get loads of possibilities, turn your knobs whenever you want and create own sound from scratch

I was curious about the programming, I'm not afraid of trying it, I think it might give many inspirastions since you build what you want to get

Is it anyway similar to computer programming, in college we do Delphi, so I though self fact of doing something what relates to programming, might be helpful, at least a bit

Programming synths does not involve any kind of coding like programming in C or Delphi.

Synth programming IS turning your knobs whenever you want and creating your own sounds from scratch The difficulty is dependent on what kind of synth you get. With a lot of VAs you just turn the knobs and you're done (which is why I suggested getting a Nord Lead 2--couldn't be easier to get classic sounds). With some other digital synths, you have to navigate through menus to find the parameters you want to change, which is not that much more difficult, but it's less immediate and inspiring.

[Mateusz]

Aaaa, now I get it So, that's fine, I though it must be something more difficult but now I know, so it will not be a problem thumbsup

I'm afraid, I won't be able to afford this Nord... which has beautiful look, a simply red

About more Korgs, microKorg is kinda small... and other small Korgs seem to be relatively expensive

I couldn't find Korg MS2000 either, MS2000B seem to be really cool as a upgraded version

And I should mention this fact, it has to be new, not second hand one, it will be a birthday gift, so I have to stick with.

I know, I am probably missing out much but that's how it is...

[gotpop]

I'm afraid, I won't be able to afford this Nord... which has beautiful look, a simply red

About more Korgs, microKorg is kinda small... and other small Korgs seem to be relatively expensive

I couldn't find Korg MS2000 either, MS2000B seem to be really cool as a upgraded version

And I should mention this fact, it has to be new, not second hand one, it will be a birthday gift, so I have to stick with.

I know, I am probably missing out much but that's how it is...

It's really too bad that it has to be new, but it's not the end of the world either.

If you're interested in the Korg synths, I used to own a MS2000 (the MS2000B is exactly the same), and I've had a lot of experience with the MicroKorg. Don't let the size of the microKorg fool you! It does have a great sound (plus the Vocoder feature of the MS2000). If you ever want to, you can plug a bigger keyboard into the MicroKorg via MIDI.

Another keyboard you might like: the Alesis ION's little brother, the Micron. I hear it's a little involved to program, but it's got the same sound engine as the Alesis ION, which I used to own as well. Not so great for pad sounds, but for the price, you'll get a machine that does wonderful bass and lead sounds.

Just curious: what is your price range? THe Micron and microKorg are both about $400, and I don't think you can go much lower for a polyphonic synth for what you're looking to do. Perhaps if these are still to expensive you might keep saving until you can get something that's gonna satisfy your needs?

Enough of my rant.

[shadowfac]

I just want to point out that you can make your own sounds, even from scratch, on a Korg X50. It's not as intuitive as turning knobs on a Nord Lead, but as I said, it comes with a software editor with which you can easily edit any parameters.

Now, the X50 costs about $750, right? If you really want a subtractive synth (virtual analog) with knobs, here's a few options in that price range:

- Korg R3: similar to microKorg but with a decent-sized keyboard and better specs.

- Novation X-Station 25/49/61: This is basically an 8-voice A-Station synth which also works as MIDI controller and audio interface. Comes in 2, 4, and 5 octave models.

- Waldorf Blofeld (desktop unit, no keyboard): this is probably one of the best deals these days. Much better sounding than any of the Korg/Roland VA synths. However, you will need a MIDI controller to play it.

I'm afraid any other options are either too limited (e.g. microKorg), too expensive (Radias, Nord, Virus, Waldorf), or not new.

[Mateusz]

It's slightly different, because I live in England The budget is the price of X50.... so £450, it's approx $672

I saw on eBay, second hand Ion for £300... and second hand MS2000 for... £250 on other web site, it is a bargain then

Well, I can't do anything about that it has to be new, at least I can be thankful, I will be able to have a synthesizer, so always there can be some positives

Probably it is well known here, I watched couple of Jexus'es videos (Ion and MS2000) on You Tube and I like both sounds of Korg and Alesis, even though they are different. Actually there is one online shop which offers a new... Alesis Ion Does Alesis still offer technical support in case of damage, I woundering since it is discoundent model

Yeah, my price range is pretty limited. To be honest I downloaded Korg X50 software to have a quick look at it, it seems to be ok, I wish just it to be in full screen mode

[gotpop]

I highly highly recommend you try to make your decision about which synth (whichever that might be in the end) by playing it in a store, if that's at all possible.

As far as the ION goes, you could definitely e-mail Alesis to find out (I hadn't even thought about tech support, which is a really important issue). Also, make sure you always buy from a reputable dealer, etc.

Good luck! Let us know what you decide in the end!

[Mateusz]

No worries, I'm going to order this in well known shop, like GAK for example. And before I want to go to nice store called Reverb Store, in Sheffield. They have a decent stock on their web site, so it wouldn't be a problem to check it out in store, I'm not looking for something rare

It seems a bit suspicious, no one has Ion in stock and one shop has it... I wouldn't go for it I think... I will try to spend this money carefuly

And after purchase I am going definetely to register the product, obviously.

I hope this visit in music store will make my mind clear about the choice. I don't think I will loose something if I will choose this synth , I can always later on buy another one to it or which direction suits me better, so expand my slutty setup , it's not something ultra rare or extremely expensive.

[Shadows Within]

if your still thinking about the X50, i would get a used Karma on ebay instead, there cheaper than a new X50 and can expand with the moss board and has after touch, chord memory and a sequencer, but it also has the same engine as the X50.

[Mateusz]

I can't go for second hand equipment as I told before, if I could then I would go for second hand Ion or something. Oh well life

Yeah and still I consider X50 as one of the choices

[Mateusz]

I checked out today...

-Juno D
-SH 201
-Juno G (I will tell in a moment why)

and V-Synth GT (just to see how machine for £1500 works and sounds It's just a brilliant thing... but it's slightly different price range...)

Juno D disappointed me as well... I tested it at first...
Synth sounds are allright but they sound too similar even though there are lots of them there. Guitars were just awful, acoustic guitars sounded like some polyphonic ringtones, distorted guitar were just random noise with farting... It would definetely benefit this product if Roland would throw them out from Juno D. Keys felt not natural and kinda sticky, I couldn't feel much when I pushed them. And display is too small as well, it can display only two lines.

At second I got my hands on Juno G... it proper impressed me. Arppegiator is much, much better than in Juno D, kyes are better. It gave much comfort while playing. Synths sounds, brass and strings are really good, pianos are ok, they sound much more real. In general sound is really deep and punchy of Juno G. Something to what you would like come back. Big display is cool and you can easily see what's going on and use of it really easy,. I was told about Juno G before but I thought it's too expensive but after today I see it's worth to wait longer and to save up for Juno G. I talked about money already and it's not a problem to delay this purchase. Well, Juno D is twice cheaper but I would have nothing at all rather Juno D, I expected something better. I had best time with Juno G and I would like to come back to this synthesiser once again

SH-201, so many knobs, I got slightly lost, I would need bit more time to get more out of it. I wouldn't see it as primary synth, more likely secondary one. But sound there is way better than in Juno D but nowhere near Juno G. Interesting thing but I don't think I would go for it yet.

Yamaha MM6, there was one there but I didn't wanted to check it because I was already told off for spending time on playing and not buying I can't remember how it sounded

It's just my subjective opinion about these synthesisers. I am sure experienced players would be able to give much more broad and detailed views.

I still have to check out Korg X50 and Yamaha MM6 but I don't expect much

[gotpop]

Yamaha MM6, there was one there but I didn't wanted to check it because I was already told off for spending time on playing and not buying

Are you kidding me? What a jerk! Screw that place and find somewhere else to buy your synth...

[Reptil]

ehm you want a keyboard with some synth bolted on or a synthesizer?

[Mateusz]

Well, at the end of day I understand it, shops want to earn.

That's a good question, I'm still deciding, SH-201 still is good option, I just need a bit more time to play with knobs to get something out of it.

So far my favourite is Juno G

And I'm still waiting to test Korg X50

[Audun the Great]

I would stick with SH 201 to be completely honest. I got mine new on ebay for only 400 and its been great. I've had it for almost 5 months now and I absolutely love the sound. I wouldn't be to scared of all the knobs either, The manual is really nice and makes it seem a lot easier to use. You can get pretty much any synth sound you can imagine on this sucker. I mean, sure it doesn't have drum sounds and doesn't have piano sounds, but if you're really into that just get a modual when you get more money? Just a suggestion. I really recommend the 201, it really does sound great. :D

[Keyflo]

Originally Posted by Audun the Great

I would stick with SH 201 to be completely honest. I got mine new on ebay for only 400 and its been great. I've had it for almost 5 months now and I absolutely love the sound. I wouldn't be to scared of all the knobs either, The manual is really nice and makes it seem a lot easier to use. You can get pretty much any synth sound you can imagine on this sucker. I mean, sure it doesn't have drum sounds and doesn't have piano sounds, but if you're really into that just get a modual when you get more money? Just a suggestion. I really recommend the 201, it really does sound great. :D

i second that the sh-201 is great, i make synths so i never get bored

[Stevil]

Originally Posted by Mateusz

It's hard choice because I don't know which site I want to go, creation of sound from scratch, or using patches and then slightly editing them...

this is a choice you can only make for yourself.
you wanna learn to program first or you wanna write songs first?
ultimately you should pick up at least one for each, thats how we wind up with synth collections.
i started with a workstation & picked up a programmable later on, i have friends that went the other direction, it's al a matter of personal preference.
imo, both would be fine first synths.

[crufty]

i would look at sh 201 -or- xstation.

microx is cool as hell, don't get me wrong but it is limited in the long run. get something with lots of knobs so that you can use it to control other synths when the time comes, and the time will come. the sh 201 probably has that ability, the xstation def has that ability.

i was in similar position and went with xstation. Its sounds are not as clean as sh 201, but its no slouch.

but I would also re-examine my setup too. what else do you have? a synth with no drums gets boring. Is a keyboard really what you need? The electribe mx1 is an easy to use synth module. It's not a good controller but it has decent drums and a nice VA that is ms2000Rish....x 5 tracks of VA. At the same time, programming it is a pia and its certainly not a set of keys if something like jump is what you are after.

have fun! microkorg is decent as well but not many knobs and small keys == teh suck. Micron is a little better in that dept...wouldn't discount the micron! I never owned one, always wanted one but have not the space nor anything else to justify.

[mpresev]

Novation K Station or XStation

Roland Juno 60

Virus B

Alesis ION synth(luved it but got traded to the RS7000)


DSI MONO EVOLVER Keyboard.