MachineDrum vs MPC?

[dsound]

I've been getting into doing remixes lately but feel completely uninspired by ITB drum sequencers (Ultrabeat, Battery, etc) and have been craving some more punchy, hands on beat creation. I'm looking at getting an MPC1000 or an MachineDrum SPS-1 UW. I don't want to only do 4x4 type remixes and I'm wondering if the MD can do more hip hop style beats and can the MPC do more dance stye stuff? I guessing that some of the top remixes both indy and commercial are not done using ITB drum sequencers.

[ignatius]

the machinedrum is very real time and synthesis oriented.

the MPC's are all samples and a bit less user friendly at first but once you get into them you can get around on them really quickly.

they're really kind of apples and oranges ya know. the mpc can get pretty intense for sequencing itself and other midi gear. the MD can too but it works quite differently and isnt quite capable of the minute editing detaills of the mpc.

btw- my friends machinedrum UW MKII has been crashing like crazy and erasing all of his kits. real drag.

my MKI is solid. i don't know what the deal is w/his. maybe just a fluke.

[lcvl]

I agree with Ignatius. They're totally different beasts, with different strenghts and peculiarities.
Get both if you can!

[jsrockit]

Both machines can do any type of music... well, any type of music that uses a drum machine. Why would you think they couldn't?

I make hip-hop influenced stuff and switched from a MPC to a MDUW MKII and a Jomox 888.

If you are all about long stereo samples, then the MDUW is not for you. That's the MPC's job. If you are into drum synthesis combined with sample manipulation...that's the MDUW's strength.

[dsound]

All good points. I guess both would be ideal. I just want to make sure before I drop that kind of cash that it's what I really need. I'm just tired of not feeling ITB loops and drum machines. I spend so much time trying to fix things to sound better. I'd rather feel it right from the start and then edit. It's like when you try a guitar amp - it should be inspiring right away and then you can add pedals and adjust eq as opposed to the other way around.

BTW, would most folks here agree that the top remixes are done with outboard gear?

[sashbash]

one thing concerning the MD-UW is that any samples loaded into it are converted to 12bit... for me it made the samples sound a bit thin and obviously grainy. I would have prefered an option on the MD-UW that gave you the choice to convert to 12bit or not. just a small complaint on an otherwise very creative tool (an MPC is also very creative too....)

[lcvl]

BTW, would most folks here agree that the top remixes are done with outboard gear?

Not necessarily... Why would that be the case?

[taktheride]

Hey All-
Can you upload samples to the machinedrum? I read this tread and it looks like it. I just wanted to confirm. Elektron's site just isn't that great. And can someone with a MD post a youtube vid of them starting a beat from scratch.... everything on youtube is all premade for the most part. I wanna see some workflow, people!

[jsrockit]

Originally Posted by taktheride

Hey All-
Can you upload samples to the machinedrum?

Yes, on the userwave model...about 20 seconds of mono, 12-bit.

[modistylee]

Wait for the Linndrum II Analog Drum Machine

That's what I'm doing. Hope it comes out early '09 or I might have to get an MPC1000 to tide me over.

Any kats on the electronic board using the JJ os?

[s12512]

get an mpc. more hits are being made on those then anything else. its arguably the best sequencer ever!

[Calvary_Band]

I have had a lot of success with the SP-1200 in that department, the unit sounds fantastic. Had more fun with that than the MPCs.

[kazper]

I'm on the look out for a SP-1200 myself.

I had lots of fun with the Sp-12T and I'm kicking myself for selling it.... so now I'll replace it with a sp-1200 or Machinedrum..

[jsrockit]

Originally Posted by kazper

I'm on the look out for a SP-1200 myself.

I had lots of fun with the Sp-12T and I'm kicking myself for selling it.... so now I'll replace it with a sp-1200 or Machinedrum..

While I love the MDUW, don't be fooled into thinking it'll give you the SP1200 sound...because i won't. The SP1200 had analog filters, 12 bit converters, and lower res samples...the MDUW only has low res samples.

[jsrockit]

Originally Posted by s12512

get an mpc. more hits are being made on those then anything else. its arguably the best sequencer ever!

Yeah, get an MPC because everyone else uses it...not because it would be the best tool for you. Have you ever used the MDUW to be offering such advice?

[PaulC]

I too am not impressed with the sound from software drums. They sound a bit flat. I would like something punchier. I find im doing a lot of eqing to try and get it stick in a mix but I find samples do fit in alot better and are punchier to my ear.. I have a question for mpc users. If you were to sample battery or bfd or ez drummer in to the mpc and then back to your computer again does it make the sound punchier?

Cheers

[jsrockit]

Originally Posted by PaulC

I have a question for mpc users. If you were to sample battery or bfd or ez drummer in to the mpc and then back to your computer again does it make the sound punchier?

The only MPC that will, theoretically, change the sound is maybe the MPC60 due to the sample rate and the older converters...and that won't even be that big. MPCs are not magic boxes...you still need to put in great samples and do everything else in the recording, production, mixing, engineering, and mastering phase to get stuff to sound great.

[sctt_stone]

If you want a fat sound without the need for additional processing buy a Jomox and then try to figure out how the hell to use it .

[Brian!]

Originally Posted by jsrockit

The only MPC that will, theoretically, change the sound is maybe the MPC60 due to the sample rate and the older converters...and that won't even be that big. MPCs are not magic boxes...you still need to put in great samples and do everything else in the recording, production, mixing, engineering, and mastering phase to get stuff to sound great.

The 3000 and 4000 will also color the sound to a certain extent. Anything else really has not much of a noticeable impact on the sound. If anyone is buying an MPC, the number one thing they should be buying it for is the sequencer anyways.

I've used a 2000XL and 1000 for a few years and loved both of them but no longer have them. I have a Machinedrum MK2 UW right now and like it a lot. The workflow is quite different but I think I work better with it than MPCs. While the RAM limit is quite restrictive, I think it helps me out in some ways in that I don't load every ****ing sample I have and have no idea how to proceed from there.

[Shim]

Originally Posted by modistylee

Any kats on the electronic board using the JJ os?

It's the only way to go
Having said that, i use jjos free (v3.?), and i've never had any need to get the full version. I hear it's awesome though. I just wanted the ability to assign individual outs and have a grid edit, and there are probably lots of other os features that i use that are jj exclusive, but i don't even remember the akai os...it was pretty damn annoying.

[dsound]

Ok, so I did it! I was working on beats for a remix today in Logic using Stylus. I love the Stylus kits but I was going through the same thing I always do which is to try to get the groove better. I used MPC templates and tried layering, etc. I was all OK but still not quite convincing. I left the studio and went and bought an MPC1000. Brought it back to the studio and started creating some beats right out of the box. Already there is such a noticable difference. I've never been so happy with just a kick and snare. The MPC sounds like the velocities are at 200! So punchy and just has 'that sound'. Really sounded great going through my Vintech. I've only scratched the surface but I am very happy and inspired. I look forward to the Linn II when it comes out. I think I'll be in beat heaven for a while.

[jsrockit]

Originally Posted by dsound

Brought it back to the studio and started creating some beats right out of the box. Already there is such a noticable difference. I've never been so happy with just a kick and snare. The MPC sounds like the velocities are at 200! So punchy and just has 'that sound'. Really sounded great going through my Vintech. I've only scratched the surface but I am very happy and inspired. I look forward to the Linn II when it comes out. I think I'll be in beat heaven for a while.

Wow, you must have gotten a magic MPC...an MPC1000 with "that sound"... In all seriousness though, there is no reason you couldn't get "that sound" in software... you must have been doing something wrong. The MPC is all about interface...

[jsrockit]

Originally Posted by Brian!

The 3000 and 4000 will also color the sound to a certain extent.

Maybe the 3000...but the 4000, why?

[dsound]

Originally Posted by jsrockit

Wow, you must have gotten a magic MPC...an MPC1000 with "that sound"... In all seriousness though, there is no reason you couldn't get "that sound" in software... you must have been doing something wrong. The MPC is all about interface...

I'm just telling you what my ears (and body) are telling me. An MPC has a sound. That's just a fact. I notice it right off the bat. Believe me, I've spent hours working with ITB grooves trying to get them to kick like this. Not the same thing.

[jsrockit]

Originally Posted by dsound

I'm just telling you what my ears (and body) are telling me. An MPC has a sound. That's just a fact. I notice it right off the bat. Believe me, I've spent hours working with ITB grooves trying to get them to kick like this. Not the same thing.

Ok... I've used both computers and hardware... I use hardware because I like hardware interfaces...but in regards to a new sampler like the 1000... I truly don't remember there being much of a sonic imprint on what I put into it... sure, the MPC can have more perceived volume since it is going straight to your speakers without any daw telling you it is too loud...but once you go to record, you will run into the same issues you had ITB (headroom). I just saying the MPC is not a magic box for making your beats bump...that is still done through processing and mixing.

[Brian!]

Originally Posted by jsrockit

Maybe the 3000...but the 4000, why?

24 bit 96khz sampling will sound different than 16 bit 44.1khz.

As far as the 1000 having a "sound", I think any of the 16 bit MPCs' sound can be attributed more to the sequencer than the sampler if that makes any sense.

[jsrockit]

Originally Posted by Brian!

24 bit 96khz sampling will sound different than 16 bit 44.1khz.

As far as the 1000 having a "sound", I think any of the 16 bit MPCs' sound can be attributed more to the sequencer than the sampler if that makes any sense.

Makes sense on both counts... but I was thinking more about the more lo-fi MPCs... not due to higher res sampling. Also, that is what I was trying to say regarding the interface being more important on the MPC than sound imparted by any special mojo.

[Pilgrim007]

Originally Posted by dsound

I'm just telling you what my ears (and body) are telling me. An MPC has a sound. That's just a fact. I notice it right off the bat. Believe me, I've spent hours working with ITB grooves trying to get them to kick like this. Not the same thing.

i was also thinking the same. Initially, I thought the MPC was just a waste. "Go get a lappie and a trigger finger and u sorted"-that's what some would say to me.

A buddy of mine bought the MPC 2500. When I heard the samples in the MPC I was immediately blown away. There is a "sound" in the MPC. There definetely is.

[boreg]

Originally Posted by dsound

I'm just telling you what my ears (and body) are telling me. An MPC has a sound. That's just a fact. I notice it right off the bat. Believe me, I've spent hours working with ITB grooves trying to get them to kick like this. Not the same thing.

When I got my brand new MPC1000, I noticed it had the master effects on - the compressor and EQ boosting lows and highs. This might explain the perceived effect of "everything sounding better thru the MPC" ;)

[dsound]

I just checked the master bus and everything is off. I did just install the JJ OS1 (still waiting for my password ). The sequencer is what feels great...very solid. I understand that it's a sampler and it will spit out what you put in. The sequencer really has a unique thing. Maybe it's like that with all hardware seq's.