Sampling with Softsamplers...Challenges

[JDN]

I'm revisiting this topic, as I've seen some threads talking about it. I miss the days of hooking up a tapedeck, turntable, or CD player, and samping directly into a hardware sampler and going at it. although i'm not missing those days enough to go back.

Currently i'm recording into logic things I want to sample, then editing a little in logic, and exporting to a folder of samples that I later import into the EXS....Just seems like a few too many steps...i really just wish you could sample directly into these softsamplers....any suggestions aside from getting hardware or a different softsampler. I just hate having to create sessions in a DAW just to get audio into the sampler.

but something tells me that's just the nature of the workflow...oh well, i can't really bitch that much, as it's made the workflow so much easier in othe respects

[Bhang]

Well ... This is an area I has lost months at. Sampling takes no time. Editing is completely different. I know what you mean. I used to set my sampler up to automatically chop my samples up (using silence between sounds to do this). Now, however I don't know of anything that will do this automatically. I have been using Soundtrack to do this. It is still the same amount of steps but to me it is set up far better than logics editor. If you use the soundtracks shortcuts you can shave off some time, but it is nothing like automatic cutting.

If anyone here has any information on a program that can do this I think a lot of people would find it useful.

[Absent1]

Originally Posted by Bhang

If anyone here has any information on a program that can do this I think a lot of people would find it useful.

Strip Silence in Logic can be helpfull at times for that.

I too feel the pain of the Exs. That is really the only softsynth I use anymore but it can be a real time waster..

I keep meaning to check out that Redmatica but it looks like it just adds extra steps.

I use Peak Bias instead of creating Logic sessions, I just bought the Le version because thats all I use it for. It is real straight forward and much easier to grab things quick.

Cheers, Rob

[zebastian21]

I know what you mean, exs is good player or samples, but to make your own samples from the arrangement it isnt fast enough. I know with strip silence you can speed up things. I know you can drag samples from arrangement directly to the esx to make new instruments, but the you have to save that as instruments or you can just save it as instruments for that particular project only?. DP 5 has a very simple sampler ala Ableton simpler.

[andrewsc]

Here is a simple wav splitting utility, waveknife:

WaveKnife

There is something called samplerobot 3 which is supposed to automate certain multisample creation tasks in a rather sophisticated way (especially sampling midi instruments).

I use Battery often, and the workflow doesn't seem too bad, you can drag and drop from windows explorer, but I don't think you can drag in clips from the Logic arrange (can you?). Even when you sample directly into the sampler you still have to assign the sample to a given note, which seems to be all you're really doing by assigning a wav file to a cell from by browsing in the filesystem. It is definitely important to be able to preview the sample easily. The non-destructive editing facilities in Battery can take the place of some destructive wave editing work, but there is still a place for basic destructive editing.

With either an external hardware sampler or the computer I think you'll be faced with the task of keeping samples organized in a given location in some way for the sampler. For some soft-samplers, I guess you don't really have to keep them organized on the PC, but if they are all over the place and one gets moved that probably messes up the multisample. If it is a requirement that you export samples to a given folder before importing them into the softsampler maybe that is a possible bottleneck, but it probably makes it more likely that your multisample will not get broken.

If opening the daw is cumbersome can you just use the soft sampler in standalone mode?

[JDN]

Originally Posted by andrewsc

If opening the daw is cumbersome can you just use the soft sampler in standalone mode?

That's my main problem, is using the DAW as a middle man. I'm using EXS which can only be used in logic. I have Kontakt, which is so unintuitive to me i'm not even interested in exploring making my own presets. But I do believe the two stand alone applications I own, Kontakt and Sampletank, don't allow you to record directly into them.

That's the whole issue, i'm so sick of generic sounds and presets everyone else has and want to go back to the days of actually pulling out the turntable, or a movie, and getting creative and making my own sounds and most of the softsampleres seem to be more set up to drag and drop sounds you already have on your Hard Drive.

I've heard that emu has a softsampler that can do all this, but i'm not interested in spending more money since i just bought the arturia v collection.

[andrewsc]

I see what you mean, and I'm all for using a sampler for one's own sounds, and interested in streamlining the process.

I'm used to opening the DAW simply to route the midi signal from my controller keyboard to an instrument.

If I weren't doing that, a program like SoundForge would be my next choice.

With the example of grabbing a sample off of a turntable, I guess I still think doing in in the DAW environment is less hassle than in a hardware sampler, because if it's in the hardware sampler you then might have to worry about getting it out of the sampler and into the DAW for whatever reason, or its on a zip disk in a brand specific format and that could get lost, damaged, SCSI transfer, naming the file, tiny screen, etc, etc.

So to follow the example with Logic, you'd need to have a spare audio track with some audio inputs ready, [have audio record path set properly], [have track name typed in properly], hit record, grab the vinyl sample, trim/crop the sample as needed, know where the sample is getting recorded, or record it into the desired location, or save a copy of the sample in the desired location. The rest is how easy your softsampler is to use. In Battery you just click on a cell and then browse for the audio file and its in there, then save the Battery kit.

In the DAW (Logic) environment sometimes I make mistakes that lead to not clearly understanding the actual location of the audio clip on the hard drive, then of course its hard to load into the softsampler.

I'm not always sure what directory the file was recorded to because I often just forget to update the "audio record path" so audio clips often end up in some unexpected folder.

The second problem is because when I record audio in Logic if the track name is Audio1, the wav file is often named something like Audio-1-122, which makes locating the proper file difficult since the filename lacks meaning. If you have the track you are recording on named properly the filename of the audio clip should assume the track name (there is an option to activate for this). One thing in Logic that made my life easier is the "Track Name to Objects" keycommand, it may rename audio clips accordingly (but I'm not sure at the moment). The audio filenames can be changed in the audio window anyway.

If I'm sure of exactly where the file was recorded and what its called, it's pretty easy to put it into the softsampler.

Kontakt is a bit complex, have you tried Battery?

[Absent1]

Originally Posted by andrewsc

I see what you mean, and I'm all for using a sampler for one's own sounds, and interested in streamlining the process.

I'm used to opening the DAW simply to route the midi signal from my controller keyboard to an instrument.

If I weren't doing that, a program like SoundForge would be my next choice.

With the example of grabbing a sample off of a turntable, I guess I still think doing in in the DAW environment is less hassle than in a hardware sampler, because if it's in the hardware sampler you then might have to worry about getting it out of the sampler and into the DAW for whatever reason, or its on a zip disk in a brand specific format and that could get lost, damaged, SCSI transfer, naming the file, tiny screen, etc, etc.

So to follow the example with Logic, you'd need to have a spare audio track with some audio inputs ready, [have audio record path set properly], [have track name typed in properly], hit record, grab the vinyl sample, trim/crop the sample as needed, know where the sample is getting recorded, or record it into the desired location, or save a copy of the sample in the desired location. The rest is how easy your softsampler is to use. In Battery you just click on a cell and then browse for the audio file and its in there, then save the Battery kit.

In the DAW (Logic) environment sometimes I make mistakes that lead to not clearly understanding the actual location of the audio clip on the hard drive, then of course its hard to load into the softsampler.

I'm not always sure what directory the file was recorded to because I often just forget to update the "audio record path" so audio clips often end up in some unexpected folder.

The second problem is because when I record audio in Logic if the track name is Audio1, the wav file is often named something like Audio-1-122, which makes locating the proper file difficult since the filename lacks meaning. If you have the track you are recording on named properly the filename of the audio clip should assume the track name (there is an option to activate for this). One thing in Logic that made my life easier is the "Track Name to Objects" keycommand, it may rename audio clips accordingly (but I'm not sure at the moment). The audio filenames can be changed in the audio window anyway.

If I'm sure of exactly where the file was recorded and what its called, it's pretty easy to put it into the softsampler.

Kontakt is a bit complex, have you tried Battery?

Just reading all this gets my gets me aggravated at Logic.

I know this is not a new gripe but seriously give people a decent way to edit audio in your flagship program.

[JDN]

I have battery and love it for drums, but i'm using the exs for pitched samples. Logics a little wierd with file management, but i think i figured it out. I just record the audio, edit it, then copy the region to a specific folder on my external hard drive of all my sounds and I only keep my custom exs samples in that folder

[rasp]

Doesn't Emu make EOS software for editing samples and controlling Emu E4 samplers via computer?

The word "softsampler" is a bit ov a misnomer. I should say "softsampleplayback-err-r-r."

[Barbary Ape]

I think GigaStudio is the only softsampler left out there that lets you sample directly into it, all other softsamplers are basically over featured playback libraries.

[jtafich]

112dB :: Vintage Virtual Instruments

Haven't test it but it looks pretty interesting.

[DivineChemical]

Originally Posted by rasp

Doesn't Emu make EOS software for editing samples and controlling Emu E4 samplers via computer?

Yeah, it's on E-Mu's site.

[Bhang]

Originally Posted by andrewsc

Here is a simple wav splitting utility, waveknife:

WaveKnife

This is exactly what I'm looking for. Now ... anything out there for Mac?