Hi-Hat Alignment?

[rcb4t2]

Err... for lack of a better word

So I've noticed recently that my hats, when closed, tend not to line up perfectly with eachother. Specifically, on the stick side, the top hat moves away from the stick, so that there's about a 1/4-1/2" gap between the edge of the bottom and top cymbals at the largest point.

Okay, tiny little needling concern, I know - I'm not really a drummer (just record 'em) so this might be a ridiculous question lol but I was wondering if this was a problem? Are the hats supposed to align with eachother?

They're top and bottom cymbals of the same size/manufacturer/model.

Is that little spring-loaded screw on the bottom of the cymbal stand a factor here?

Thanks guys - forgive my ignorance.

[Gamelan]

That little screw is the angle adjustment. The bottom cymbal is angled to taste to get a tighter or looser attack (also to keep the cymbals from "sticking" together and choking the sound).

[chrisso]

It's usually a positive when they don't line up.
If they sit perfectly together you'll get an airlock and weird/choked sounding hi-hats.

[Pawel]

Proper inclination of bottom cymbal is the key to achieve a nice foot chick sound.

[rcb4t2]

Awesome, thanks guys - still learning!

[joeq]

They're top and bottom cymbals of the same size/manufacturer/model.

some drummers even intentionally purchase mismatched cymbals for their top and bottom hi-hats

[Jax]

The angle of the bottom cymbal isn't just about getting a good 'chick' sound when stepping on the pedal. It's that, but it also directly affects how much wash or sizzle the hats will make when played semi-open, and when foot-splashing (quickly stepping and releasing to get a crash-like sound).

By the way, how much space do you guys like between your top and bottom cymbals?

I see drummers who have them spaced so they don't touch when open and they control the wash from anywhere in between none and closed. I prefer having them fairly open so the hats are a bit chattery and washy to begin with, and having all other levels of wash controllable from there.

[Jax]

Originally Posted by chrisso

It's usually a positive when they don't line up.
If they sit perfectly together you'll get an airlock and weird/choked sounding hi-hats.

Some hats are drilled on the bottom cymbal to prevent airlock. I like this idea because it allows for a less clangy and chattery-sounding wash if the cymbals are closer to being level. I think quick beats are drilled, but I don't care for that particular model. I could see drilling a pair of vintage new beats unless they end up sounding like quick's.

[joeq]

Originally Posted by Jax

By the way, how much space do you guys like between your top and bottom cymbals?

I see drummers who have them spaced so they don't touch when open ...

whoa
way too open for me

I have mine so that they are still touching about 1/3 of the way around when "fully open" and then close from there. I think my 'open' is more closed than some guys' 'closed'

partly because I like to make more use of the tighter sounds in my playing in general and partly because it's less work to step on the pedal when it only has to go a few inches.

I do a lot of foot-splashes, oddly enough

the third factor is how tight do you make your top cymbal in its clutch?
mine is pretty tight, but loosening that up is another way to approach the sizzle

[Jax]

Originally Posted by joeq

whoa
way too open for me

I have mine so that they are still touching about 1/3 of the way around when "fully open" and then close from there.

I've experimented with how much my hats touch when open and it tends to vacillate over the years. For some stretch of time I'll be playing them about how you describe and others how I have 'em now - about 1/4 touching or less. Maybe it depends on what type of music project or band I'm stuck with.

the third factor is how tight do you make your top cymbal in its clutch?
mine is pretty tight, but loosening that up is another way to approach the sizzle

I'm using those weird Pearl rubber washers in the clutch and they took some getting used to. The clutch is set so they're applying just enough pressure to keep the cymbal from tilting down more than about an inch to 1.5" when struck fortissimo. I find this a pretty good balance that covers most of what I play. With my hats, going tighter makes them feel too stiff and sound almost like they're buzzing and rattling rather than sizzling.

[Pawel]

Hats should be 2 inches apart when opened and not touching, the excursion should be the same as the kickdrum pedal, so when you play them together with feet the sounds are coincident. If the hats are too closed and you play with both feet together, hat chick comes before the kickdrum boom.

[chrisso]

I don't think there are any rules.
And I also don't find the angle of the bottom cymbal changes the wash or rattle too much, with of course an 'everything in moderation' type setting.
I adjust the level of wash and rattle I want with my left foot on the hi-hat pedal.
Vintage New Beats are some of the best sounding hi-hats money can buy. I wouldn't dream of drilling them personally.

[Jax]

Originally Posted by Pawel

Hats should be 2 inches apart when opened and not touching, the excursion should be the same as the kickdrum pedal, so when you play them together with feet the sounds are coincident. If the hats are too closed and you play with both feet together, hat chick comes before the kickdrum boom.

Sorry, but this post makes me a little impatient. Please don't present your formula like it's the 'one size fits all' truth. Hi hat setup is a matter of personal preference, not a science. You present your idea as if every drum teacher knows the same thing and would teach it to all students, which is not reality.

[Pawel]

Sorry, maybe because I'm italian I can't express myself properly in english, or maybe you misread my intention.

I wrote "should", not "must", so that means that's only a suggestion of how it could be it's not a "one fits all" solution, but if you look at pictures of the greatest drummers, you see that hats are around 2 inches apart, and even more (except for drummers like Horacio El negro who needs them almost closed to sound properly while switching between cowbell-pedal and hat-pedal).

I think I read or saw a video with this suggestion made by John Riley or another great drum teacher.

Don't be impatient, there's no need to! No arrogance here at all

[surfspank]

Whoa there boys, this is a freaking discussion about Hi-Hats...save the bravado for Gating the Kick or something like that. We're all Drummers and should know by now there are a billions of different ways to go about doing it.
Jax to answer your question, I like them just barely touching at one edge when open. I am not a really hard hitter and I find if I leave them a little floppy and barely touching, that I get a little more volume when open. I also find that I have more precise control over their volume with my hat foot when they are set up that way. I also used a drilled bottom....I'll never go back to undrilled. I like the feel and sound better with the drilled, but that's just me.

[chrisso]

Originally Posted by Pawel

but if you look at pictures of the greatest drummers, you see that hats are around 2 inches apart

There are no rules.
I think one should just adjust your hi-hats so they sound good to you, and maybe any clients (bands/producers) you end up working with.

[CompEq]

Originally Posted by Gamelan

That little screw is the angle adjustment.

+1. Record it at different positions. Get a feel for how the hats play at different angles.

Originally Posted by pawel

Hats should be 2 inches apart when opened and not touching

I generally keep mine anywhere from 3/4" to 1 1/4" when open. 2" Just seems way too open for me, but yeah I've seen drummers who do that, too.

Aside from these things, give the cyimbals a turn (yeah, literally spin them - while turning, open them just a hair). When they stop the "chick" will be either more pronounced or less prononuced. When it sounds good for your application, there's your position.

Works with the ride cymbal, too (spinning it). Mine sounds drastically different depending on which "side" you play it on. Offers an amazing array of different flavors.