Rim Shot Preventer
cc1
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#1
6th March 2011
Old 6th March 2011
  #1
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Rim Shot Preventer

Is there a device that can clip on a snare drum (rubber, etc) that helps reduce the crack of a rim shot?
#2
6th March 2011
Old 6th March 2011
  #2
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Why the hell would you want to do that?

Rim shot is a distinct sound and technique. If your drummer can't easily alternate between hitting the head or simultaneously hitting the head he needs to shed, shed, and then shed some more! This is snare drum tone 101.

Of course, different hoops and different shells have different sounds. If you're got a spare wood hoop that will fit, try it. Diecast and flanged hoops also sound vastly different, different alloys make a big difference.
#3
6th March 2011
Old 6th March 2011
  #3
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how about just angling the snare so your drummer cant easily rimshot.
cc1
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#4
6th March 2011
Old 6th March 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTStudios View Post
Why the hell would you want to do that?
it may be useful from time to time.. some rock drummers rim shot 100% of the time - that is the technique and its fine with me.. -there's also a certain feel you get when the stick strikes an immovable object like a metal rim (this is to refer to adamcal's comment too).. i was just thinking maybe on a song a rimshoting drummer can play the way he plays but there could be some (butyl?) barrier to ease the crack some.. thanks for replies.. also, would a wood hoop lessen the crack at all? also #2 any comments on signal processing would be great too.. ringo used to throw blankets on the drums... i also saw a video of mick fleetwood doing something like that as well -c
#5
6th March 2011
Old 6th March 2011
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What are you trying to do?
cc1
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#6
7th March 2011
Old 7th March 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dullfangs View Post
What are you trying to do?
Just record a drummer rim shoting on every snare hit (thats how he plays) and take some of the bite off it.. it could be helpful for playing live as well -less of smack on innocent bystanders..
#7
7th March 2011
Old 7th March 2011
  #7
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Any decent drummer should be able to play both ways - rimshot and center hit.
I suggest you suggest that to the drummer.
Yes, I think wood hoops are less harsh. But they can be expensive to buy, especially if you want some that'll stand up to constant rimshots from a rock drummer.
#8
7th March 2011
Old 7th March 2011
  #8
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I think it has been said plenty of times here already...if it doesn't sound good, fix the drummer not the drums.


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#9
7th March 2011
Old 7th March 2011
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamcal View Post
how about just angling the snare so your drummer cant easily rimshot.
Done.. if he can play it like that.


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cc1
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#10
7th March 2011
Old 7th March 2011
  #10
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
Any decent drummer should be able to play both ways - rimshot and center hit.
I suggest you suggest that to the drummer.
Yes, I think wood hoops are less harsh. But they can be expensive to buy, especially if you want some that'll stand up to constant rimshots from a rock drummer.
Well we're old and we're hobbyists.. so, although we appreciate practice and decent musicians -we're just focusing on other stuff.. great point about the longevity of a wood rim in this circumstance as well.. thanks to all for your replies.. -c
#11
7th March 2011
Old 7th March 2011
  #11
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If you want to experiment, go to an auto parts store and pick up some car door edge moulding and apply that to the drum rim edge.
#12
8th March 2011
Old 8th March 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTStudios View Post
Why the hell would you want to do that?
plus one more.
#13
8th March 2011
Old 8th March 2011
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i can understand the need for this. Some drummers just crack too hard on the rim and drums by themselves sound good but you add in the mix and the snare is really pokey and annoying. There's also not much beef to the snare. More rim = less beef. There's a fine balance of how much rimshot and how much head strike.

I would use a really fast compressor on the way in such as 1176 or distressor. and not plug in equivalents...they're not as fast as the outboard. 2:1 shave off a couple db's to soften up the hits. You could also use transient designer and take down the attack.

Mic technique can also help. Shoot the mic across the head and back it off the snare instead of aiming it at point of impact. Mix in some room samples and/or close mic samples. Compress overheads and room with fast attack and fast release. All these things will soften it up
#14
8th March 2011
Old 8th March 2011
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Why not rubber coat the sticks instead of the rim? Maybe paint a band on them, so they can still get a hard rim shot when they want to.
#15
8th March 2011
Old 8th March 2011
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I often play rim-shotty sounds without actually contacting the rim. The rim is the least of it, IMO.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Hamm View Post
Why not rubber coat the sticks instead of the rim? Maybe paint a band on them, so they can still get a hard rim shot when they want to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassmankr
If you want to experiment, go to an auto parts store and pick up some car door edge moulding and apply that to the drum rim edge.
These posts inspired me to experiment. I just tried this out on my snare:

I draped a mouse pad over the rim of the drum and played a rim shot across it. It sounded exactly like a rim shot. I took the mouse pad off, contacted the bare metal of the hoop, it sounded only a tiny tiny bit 'rimmier' than with the mouse pad.

Well a mouse pad is pretty thick, but maybe I just need something more. So I folded the mouse pad in half for double thickness and put it on the rim, and did a rim shot across that.

Still sounds the same= exactly like a rim shot.

A LOT of what we characterize as a 'rim shot' is the extreme angle of the stick, and the off center impact point. Even if you muffle the hoop or the stick itself, it will still sound like a rim shot in the "poke through the mix" sense.

I doubt you are going to get a 'center hit' sound until the drummer is capable of hitting the drum in the center.

Retrain the drummer, or replace the drummer,

(or sample-replace the snare)
#16
8th March 2011
Old 8th March 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
A LOT of what we characterize as a 'rim shot' is the extreme angle of the stick, and the off center impact point.
Whaaa? Off centre? I practiced my ass off to make every backbeat consistently rimshotted, dead centre, and the right skin/rim balance and the right spot between lugs!

But to the OP, if you're having trouble with too much click try moving the mic around. I normally have the opposite problem, I love a big transient! Nothing bums my day more than drummers that don't rimshot and then want me to make them sound loud.

The other thing to think about is a little saturation, back in the tape days that big transient would be smoothed out with tape compression (Which didn't have a big breath after the transient like compressors have to)

Also, muck about with sticks. Different sticks have a huge impact on the sound. Especially on the attack.
#17
8th March 2011
Old 8th March 2011
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OK, so it looks like your only solution is to use metal sticks and electrify the rim with a cattle prod type device.
#18
8th March 2011
Old 8th March 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTStudios View Post
Whaaa? Off centre? I practiced my ass off to make every backbeat consistently rimshotted, dead centre, and the right skin/rim balance and the right spot between lugs!
wherever you hit, try the mouse pad on the rim thing - even double mouse pad, and see if it significantly alters the 'rimminess'....
#19
9th March 2011
Old 9th March 2011
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cc1 View Post
Well we're old and we're hobbyists.. so, although we appreciate practice and decent musicians -we're just focusing on other stuff..
It's not that hard to center hit the snare instead of rimshotting it.
It's just not that hard a task to perform.
#20
25th March 2011
Old 25th March 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
It's not that hard to center hit the snare instead of rimshotting it.
It's just not that hard a task to perform.
Plus one on that!
#21
25th March 2011
Old 25th March 2011
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
It's not that hard to center hit the snare instead of rimshotting it.
It's just not that hard a task to perform.
It's easy, the same way that not bashing the hi-hat is easy.
#22
25th March 2011
Old 25th March 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Hamm View Post
OK, so it looks like your only solution is to use metal sticks and electrify the rim with a cattle prod type device.
Rimshot!
#23
26th March 2011
Old 26th March 2011
  #23
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You might want to try lowering the snare drum two inches or so. Then the angle of approach of the stick will be naturally a little different, catching more head and less rim.
#24
26th March 2011
Old 26th March 2011
  #24
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All of the snare/mic positioning, getting the drummer to hit the snare different ways, etc are all correct. However, if for whatever reason, you still want exactly what you were looking for, you want Pintech SilenTrim. I used to use it on a kit I converted to an electronic kit.

https://www.pintechworld.com/shop/sc...?idCategory=34
#25
26th March 2011
Old 26th March 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamelan View Post
You might want to try lowering the snare drum two inches or so. Then the angle of approach of the stick will be naturally a little different, catching more head and less rim.
With the geometric corrollary that your drummer has a much better chance of racking himself. Which will certainly teach him that his technique isn't working. But it might not teach him a new technique quickly enough to save the session.

I think the blanket and pintech ideas are far preferable. You could also just put a strip of gaff tape around the rim, and maybe tape down a piece of cloth or felt over the exact spot where the stick hits the rim, so the rest of the rim can still move a bit with the drum's notes, but the stick doesn't give it as much a direct hit. I'd guess a moongel would rip if you left it hanging over the edge, but it might be worth a shot, too.

Or just stop telling your drummer so many bad jokes.
#26
30th March 2011
Old 30th March 2011
  #26
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you want to prevent the drummer from doing what?
Attached Thumbnails
Rim Shot Preventer-rimshot.jpg  
#27
2nd April 2011
Old 2nd April 2011
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I hit 100% rimshots for most rock tracks and would pack you into a box and ship you to Siberia if you walked into my studio and tried to adjust my snare location, setup, or tried to adjust what you perceive as an "undesireable" sound.

It is "The Sound." When Im done with long session, my 2B's look like the picture above and the area behind my kit looks like a beaver and a woodpecker got into fight inside a lumbermill.

We have practiced for years to be able to get the sound we want out of a drum. If we wanted to reduce the crack of the rimshot, we could do it just by adjusting our playing style, we dont need you to "fix it."

#28
24th April 2011
Old 24th April 2011
  #28
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Rimshots activate the shell in a way hitting the head alone cannot do. It's generally a favored sound for louder styles and is an important factor in deciding which shell material to have for your next snare.

That said, try Gibraltar drum bumpers. Very cheap, come in a multi pack and should do the trick.
#29
14th May 2011
Old 14th May 2011
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdog View Post
I hit 100% rimshots for most rock tracks and would pack you into a box and ship you to Siberia if you walked into my studio and tried to adjust my snare location, setup, or tried to adjust what you perceive as an "undesireable" sound.

It is "The Sound." When Im done with long session, my 2B's look like the picture above and the area behind my kit looks like a beaver and a woodpecker got into fight inside a lumbermill.

We have practiced for years to be able to get the sound we want out of a drum. If we wanted to reduce the crack of the rimshot, we could do it just by adjusting our playing style, we dont need you to "fix it."

This man speaks the truth.
Never...
...ever...
...mess with my snare setup.
#30
14th May 2011
Old 14th May 2011
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isterpuck View Post
This man speaks the truth.
Never...
...ever...
...mess with my snare setup.
Hate to be the producer working with you fullas!
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