Open hi hat problem ?

[Canulgenci]

Hello there, i have confused about something while recording drums. I can't configure overheads while recording when the drummer opens the hi hat. Because i can't get powerful crashes from OHs while the hihat opened. All the energy consumed by it. So how do you manage to protect crash sound while OH records open hats ?

[Peterson Goodwyn]

This is an all-too-common problem and, unfortunately, there's no really effective solution that you can do. There IS a very easy and infinitely effective technique the DRUMMER can do, and that is to play the hi-hat as softly as possible (while maintaining the feel). It is a skill that be acquired without too much practice, so if you have a chance to talk to the drummer you will be recording a couple of weeks before the session, you might be able to gently encourage him or her to work on it.

[camerondye]

Tell the drummer nicely to stop bashing the hh or you'll tape it shut

[Canulgenci]

well that's sad but drummer is the only hope i guess. thanks lads.

[oxide54]

Originally Posted by Canulgenci

well that's sad but drummer is the only hope i guess. thanks lads.

great recordings start with great players! (and great engineers too! )

[Savvyspoon]

An engineer that I commonly work with used to just loosen the clutch so that the drummer could keep time all he wanted using his left foot without any bleed into the OH.... Just an idea

[joeq]

1. dedicated hat mic
2. crank this mic in the drummer's cans
3. I'm not kidding

[Neily]

Originally Posted by joeq

1. dedicated hat mic
2. crank this mic in the drummer's cans
3. I'm not kidding

That's an awesome idea!

[RockManDan]

yea unfortunately there is no easy solution to the problem. although you can experiement with quieter hihats. you may not realize how much different sets of HH cymbals vary in volume until you try them out side by side. old zildjian new beats are good go-to cymbals because they sound good without being obnoxiously loud. Also try to get the drummer to set his HH so that when his foot isnt pressed down, they are still pretty close to each other and touching. THe distance between teh hihats should (to my ears) never be such that the two cymbals are just sloshing around and only partially touchign each other. TO get that nice defined sizzle, set them close to each other (and use that little adjustment angle screw underneath to angle up one side of the bottom hh) and see how long the sustain of the chsshhhhh is. If its a fairly fast song, you dont need much than an 8th note. FOr slow songs you can open it up a little more so that it matches the tempo. THis to me is just as important as matching delay/reverb times to teh speed of the song.

[RubixGroove]

This is definitley a killer! When I was fourteen, recording my first album, this happened as a result of me being a rather inexperienced player at the time!

Just a little forward conversation from you should put the topic at-hand in his/her brain. Politely, at first. And, if the session is already going on and he/she's STILL doing it... find one of them 57s layin' around and throw it really hard at their head...

Honestly though, just bring it up ahead of time to the player. Of course, in a non-****** way, and I'm sure that they'd be interested in enough in helping their own playing out that... well... they might actually TRY it BEFORE hitting the studio. Who'da thunk it?!

And if that doesn't work, I'm sure the idea of cranking their cans would get the message, clearly, across.

[joeq]

Originally Posted by RubixGroove

And if that doesn't work, I'm sure the idea of cranking their cans would get the message, clearly, across.

I really don't think of it as punishment, honestly I don't. It's just biofeedback.

IME, the result of turning the hat up in the cue mix is not due to a 'message' being delivered. The player simply hears his hi-hat so loud and clear that he backs off. I think this completely subconscious, at least I have never had anyone SAY anything to me about it!

Closed cans have a muffling effect, cutting down highs more than lows, so a theoretically 'balanced' HP mix will be blending with the 'muffled' acoustic bleed, unbalancing what the drummer hears in the direction of more lows / less cymbals.

I have always been sharply aware of how the cue mix affects performance and I like to give it special consideration.

This is just an extreme example of the general principal.

[zzfdvz@mac.com]

Get a pair of Zildjian Special Recording Hi-Hats. Only 12" and MUCH quieter than standard hats. I use them often with drummers lacking proper dynamics. They might sound a little off compared to regular 14s, but they sit great in a mix.

[Gajdzin]

Originally Posted by zzfdvz@mac.com

Get a pair of Zildjian Special Recording Hi-Hats. Only 12" and MUCH quieter than standard hats. I use them often with drummers lacking proper dynamics. They might sound a little off compared to regular 14s, but they sit great in a mix.

I was just going to suggest this... I had a pair of 13" hats and they were much sweeter and quieter than my regular 14". I had them stolen on stage, unfortunately :-(

[Nu-tra]

The drummer has to practice laying off the hat and hitting the drums hard. I also use cympads on the hihat alaong with quieter hats. No more problems