Is it the wood ?

AllAboutTone · 11th February 2009

I realize in recording drums that heads, tuning and room all play a role. But do you find all the older drums such as the older Gretsch, Slingerland and Ludwig to name a few that really stand out, so is it like guitars ? Is it in the wood ?
I find the older stuff really stands out and has that vintage tone as well, depending on the heads.
Give me your input on this !!!!!

drumzealot · 11th February 2009

Wood-type does effect the sound but not as much as most think. Those vintage drums were made of whatever was available at the time, mostly mahogany (the good kind). However, the construction was consistent. Thin shells, gluerings, standard depths, and number of plies were more important than wood-type.
If you were to build two drums that were identical in every way except for wood-type, the difference in sound would be hard to detect.
From my experience these factors determine the sound of a drum listed in order of importance (I’m excluding drummer and room on purpose and also assume that the shell is perfectly round):
1. Thickness of shell
2. Head
3. Mounting technique
4. Construction type (ply, segment, stave, or one-piece)
5. Wood-type (or material type)
6. Depth of shell
7. Size of stick
8. Bearing edge profile
9. Hoop type
10. Venting
11. Smoothness of interior walls
For course, the order of importance is debatable, but this is more or less correct. Those who disagree with me are devil worshiping pillow biters. Don’t listen to them lest you be sucked into the abyss.

chrisso · 11th February 2009

I think almost all contemporary kits record very well.
The difference I've found with older kits is quality plus character.

Ludwig Keystone and Gretsch RB/SSB sound completely different from each other.
I find many modern kits sound the same.
It's all good.
I love to play vintage drums for recording, but many modern kits are no slouches either.

MarkRB · 11th February 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by AllAboutTone

I realize in recording drums that heads, tuning and room all play a role. But do you find all the older drums such as the older Gretsch, Slingerland and Ludwig to name a few that really stand out, so is it like guitars ? Is it in the wood ?
I find the older stuff really stands out and has that vintage tone as well, depending on the heads.
Give me your input on this !!!!!

Well being the main material I'm sure it has something to do with it.
I notice it more with guitars. Every good guitar has an underlying resonance that comes from the the body.
But it has to be the same concept with a kit, although the wood obviously has to go through a heavier manufacturing process to become a drum and there are certainly more variables with a kit, like skins, hardware holes etc.

AllAboutTone · 11th February 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisso

I find many modern kits sound the same.

I do as well far as Live, studio No, I still like Sonor the best for modern.

biggator6 · 12th February 2009

I'm with Zealot - though I think I'd put 'heads' and 'tuning' even above thickness.

There was an article a few months back in one of the magazines (Modern Drummer?) where they interviewed a bunch of drum makers.. they were all asked to rate what was most important, nobody ranked 'shell material' higher than about 4th place.

11th February 2009	#1
AllAboutTone Gear Guru Joined: Nov 2005 Location: S.Carolina Posts: 11,471 Thread Starter	Is it the wood ? I realize in recording drums that heads, tuning and room all play a role. But do you find all the older drums such as the older Gretsch, Slingerland and Ludwig to name a few that really stand out, so is it like guitars ? Is it in the wood ? I find the older stuff really stands out and has that vintage tone as well, depending on the heads. Give me your input on this !!!!! __________________ *Don't Fuk with my Tone !!!. I need a spell check app Harrison~ API~ Dan Alexander~ Fuchs~ John Hardy~ JLM~ Urei/UA Fuchs Amps = Amazing Tone !!**

11th February 2009	#2
drumzealot Lives for gear Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 834	Wood-type does effect the sound but not as much as most think. Those vintage drums were made of whatever was available at the time, mostly mahogany (the good kind). However, the construction was consistent. Thin shells, gluerings, standard depths, and number of plies were more important than wood-type. If you were to build two drums that were identical in every way except for wood-type, the difference in sound would be hard to detect. From my experience these factors determine the sound of a drum listed in order of importance (I’m excluding drummer and room on purpose and also assume that the shell is perfectly round): 1. Thickness of shell 2. Head 3. Mounting technique 4. Construction type (ply, segment, stave, or one-piece) 5. Wood-type (or material type) 6. Depth of shell 7. Size of stick 8. Bearing edge profile 9. Hoop type 10. Venting 11. Smoothness of interior walls For course, the order of importance is debatable, but this is more or less correct. Those who disagree with me are devil worshiping pillow biters. Don’t listen to them lest you be sucked into the abyss. __________________ "The fact is that censorship always defeats its own purpose, for it creates, in the end, the kind of society that is incapable of exercising real discretion." -Henry Steele Commager

11th February 2009	#3
chrisso Gear Guru Joined: Oct 2002 Location: Oz Posts: 16,836	I think almost all contemporary kits record very well. The difference I've found with older kits is quality plus character. Ludwig Keystone and Gretsch RB/SSB sound completely different from each other. I find many modern kits sound the same. It's all good. I love to play vintage drums for recording, but many modern kits are no slouches either. __________________ Chris Whitten

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Why the wood floors	skiroy	So much gear, so little time!	43	5th September 2008 11:39 PM
Fabric or wood?	Old Goat	Studio building / acoustics	4	20th June 2008 10:11 PM
CinderBlock or Wood	SaviorSoulMusic	Low End Theory	7	1st March 2007 08:14 PM
Wood in the basement	drmmrboy	The Good News Channel	4	11th February 2006 12:17 AM
wood snare	Labs	Low End Theory	28	6th November 2005 02:44 AM

12th February 2009	#6
biggator6 Lives for gear Joined: May 2004 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 2,979	I'm with Zealot - though I think I'd put 'heads' and 'tuning' even above thickness. There was an article a few months back in one of the magazines (Modern Drummer?) where they interviewed a bunch of drum makers.. they were all asked to rate what was most important, nobody ranked 'shell material' higher than about 4th place.