Which heads for a vintage Beatles style sound?

[djanogil]

Single ply, double ply ?

[Blindside]

My guess would be an ambassador (Remo)

The Remo "Vintage A" was supposedly the first "non-hide" head made in the '50s. I got one of the re-issues recently and LOVED it on snare. Too bad I can't find them now...

[Philip S Bova]

I would try coated Diplomats for the Ringo sound. Early-mid 60's Luddies used to come with ultra thin (thinner than a Remo Diplomat) Weather Master drum heads. I don't know if Ringo used the stock heads or not but if you listen to the tom sounds up until the Sgt Pepper era, the toms are usually cranked high into Jazz territory. With the vintage Ludwig 3 ply shell and the rounded edges sometimes ambassadors can almost be too muted sounding. They start to choke up at high tunings and can have dull attack if the edges are outta whack, which they usually are.

[biggator6]

throw thin towels over the drums... that's what Ringo did (and a pack of cigarettes on the snare)

[rdc333]

Didn't Ringo use calfskin heads ? ?

Aquarian makes Modern Vintage™ Series: A coated, single ply drumhead available in either a medium weight or thin weight. This drumhead features a special coating that has the look, feel and warm sound of a calfskin head.

Aquarian

I think there are one or two companies still making calfskin heads, so, if you want to be a purist, check "Not So Modern Drummer":

Not So Modern Drummer

Hope this helps . . .

[djanogil]

Thanks for your replies,

I do the towel thing for certain songs but not everything.
Right now I'm playing coated Emperor and it's not exactly what I'm looking for,
I'll try thinner single ply then..

Maybe I should change kit instead,
I have an English made Yamaha Recording custom.

[chrisso]

Originally Posted by djanogil

I have an English made Yamaha Recording custom.

Japanese surely.

Ludwig (keystone) will get you the Ringo sound.
They are quite cheap used.
I would go with coated Ambassadors.
I'm pretty sure they didn't use calfskin heads on any Beatles albums.

[djanogil]

Originally Posted by chrisso

Japanese surely.

Ludwig (keystone) will get you the Ringo sound.
They are quite cheap used.
I would go with coated Ambassadors.
I'm pretty sure they didn't use calfskin heads on any Beatles albums.

Well, I can read " made in England " on the drums..

[84K]

if you want the 'later album' Beatles sound, don't use bottom heads on the toms.

[drumzealot]

Single ply coated on both top and bottom. Tom with reenforcement hoops (old Ludwig, Rogers, or any DW) would do.

Originally Posted by djanogil

Well, I can read " made in England " on the drums..

Can you post pics? I believe you. But I have never heard of a Yamaha drum made in the UK.

[djanogil]

Originally Posted by drumzealot

Single ply coated on both top and bottom. Tom with reenforcement hoops (old Ludwig, Rogers, or any DW) would do.



Can you post pics? I believe you. But I have never heard of a Yamaha drum made in the UK.

It looks like any RC9000, it's from 1993, and at the time, Yamaha drums were made in the Premier factory in the UK.
I don't have pictures of the kit, but really it doesn't look anything special.

[wellers73]

Originally Posted by chrisso

Japanese surely.

Ludwig (keystone) will get you the Ringo sound.
They are quite cheap used.
I would go with coated Ambassadors.
I'm pretty sure they didn't use calfskin heads on any Beatles albums.

Ringo has said in a few interviews that he used calf heads on the of the 5 piece maple finished Ludwig kit he used on Abbey Road and Let It Be.

I have a late 60's Ludwig (keystone badge) kit, and with Remo coated ambassadors it sounds very much like Ringo's drums on St. Pepper.

Another consideration is that he used smaller sizes on the early Beatles recordings - 12" rack, 14" floor, 20" kick - used until June 1964. Afterwards it was 13" rack, 16" floor, 22" kick.

[Hamburg58]

I used to play Ringo in a trib band. Honestly it depends on what you want them for...As far as recording, the Fyberskins sound great on a downbeat kit... Downbeat being a 20 kick, 14 floor, 12 rack, 5x14 snare.....You can find vintage ones on the bay for cheap.... Ringo always had a good tom sound with hardly any overtones...Know why? Because they were never miked and Ringo could tune drums...And if you notice, later on when they did start to mic the toms, at this point ringo was using "tea cloths" not towels to muffle...

Closest to a tea towl would be a Dish Towel of some sort. This works the best.

The regular Remo Weatherkings are great for Ringo as well..Ringo was not very keen on changing out heads..When The Beatles toured America, Ringo brought a snare and his cymbals. They had backline Vox amps and Ludwig drums everywhere they played. Some of these kits where brought over for Ringo, but many times it was backline from Drum City.

Beat your heads in quite a bit before you track with them to get rid of the overtones that happen with the Remo Weatherkings...You don't want these overtones! Ringo never had them...Don't tape the drum etc...Beat it down....

Also want to get that Ringo kick sound? The blunt boomy fast kick sound? Don't stick a pillow in your kick. Don't cut a hole in your batter head. Take an old tee shirt. Cut 4 inch wide strips down and make sure they're long enough to stretch over your kick heads.. When you put the heads on, put the strips of cloth horizontally under the head and then screw down your lugs, tune the kick accordingly...

John Bonham did this too. With Ludwig drums and those types of heads, it's a very successful way to get a solid sound...Back then they didn't have Evans drum mufflers...They just did what sounded right, and it works...

Just my two cents on a few ringo things...If you ever wonder about anything else about him, cymbals, etc...feel free to ask I have way too many cymbals...And recording techniques for home applications, trying to get the beatles sound, rather you have lots of gear or little, I can help ya

[andy_simpson]

Don't forget, much of that sound was particular mics - overhead Coles 4038 in the early days and AKG D19 in the later days.... and tubes..... and Fairchild!

Andy

[Hamburg58]

Originally Posted by andy_simpson

Don't forget, much of that sound was particular mics - overhead Coles 4038 in the early days and AKG D19 in the later days.... and tubes..... and Fairchild!

Andy

Indeed! The D19 for getting the Ringo sound is an easy thing to do. The 4038, you're going to need a few more things other than a mic to get the right sound. Those mics are extremely sensitive to direction on a drum kit. The D19 does the trick with one go. They were using the D19 on the snare and toms even in the later days. D20 on the kick and sometimes even the 4038.

The best advice I can give is to be able to get your sound with one mic. That's the key to getting a good Ringo sound. In the early days, the snare really spoke through the drum mixes well and it was never miked. Ringo knew how to tune a snare. And his hats were always well balanced as well...However sometimes they were quite loud in the mixes!

Also good to have up a room mic, and pan it the opposite of the overhead...They used to sing the vocals live in the same room as the kit therefore it gives it a very live feeling. And many times for overdubs, they actually pumped the mixes back out with large speakers and sung the vocals or played their parts over the speakers...This also bled a lot of drumkit. They didn't have headphones in Abbey Road until late 1965. Revolver was the first album The Beatles used headphones on.

[andy_simpson]

Originally Posted by Hamburg58

....
And many times for overdubs, they actually pumped the mixes back out with large speakers and sung the vocals or played their parts over the speakers...

A great point! I've done a few recordings this way. It is also a great way to get real dynamics from the performers, especially vocal performances which rarely need compression and have more confidence & 'vibe'.

Easier to mix the results too.

Andy