13th December 2012
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#31 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: Melbourne : Australia :
Posts: 1,222
Thread Starter  | Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderTow  Hey Vin,
I don't think any threads have been deleted. I just see threads moved around and not properly relinked. I could be wrong of course. | Hey Alistair,
The thread I was actually referring to was definitely deleted, it was posted by a close friend who is one of the most knowledgeable multi DAW users I have encountered in many a year. His post simply outlined the issues he had encountered , some work arounds , etc. It was deleted without warning.
The first thread I linked to was moved and I relinked, it has now either been moved again or its deleted as well. According to the poster here who went off 1/2 cocked, its also been deleted.
The idiocy in deleted that thread was the issues being reported at the time were 100% valid, Steinberg had released C7 onto the market with a significant issue with the latest eLicenser ( not the one initially installed , an updated but still broken version ). The fix was posted 1 week later.
Not to mention one of the demos was created in "7.01" and is totally inoperable in 7.0 unless several of the plugins are disabled , so who exactly is BETA and QA this rollout is my question ? !!
There has been a flood of issues being reported simply because they have rushed it to market and have not crossed the t's and dotted the i's. Again the end users are finding issue in a few minutes that was totally missed by BETA / Q.A, it just isn't good enough IMO.
@ Uarte,
They are deleting and censoring commentary on the forum , I wouldn't be able to participate in the manner that some there have free reign to. So you do the math. Don't be fooled by any so called more open/positive vibe, its the same ole same ole, as soon as something they deem hits the "too hard basket" , its deleted/censored.
Swinging this back to the actual topic at hand, ASIO Guard testing, as soon as I get a clear breath. It will be over the XMas / New Year period, there will be at least one update to C7 by then so hopefully they will settle some of the mess in the meantime.
@ Dandruff,
ASIO Guard is nothing like the Anticipative processing in Reaper , the anticipative engine is a highly refined multi-threading model , whereas ASIO Guard it is simply a mechanism for hybrid buffering on playback of the elements that it can actually work with . Also Reaper does not have any caveats attached to Multi Part Virtual Instruments / Streaming Samplers, etc , ohhh, and it works... :-)  | 
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13th December 2012
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#32 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: the Netherlands
Posts: 5,037
| Quote:
Originally Posted by TAFKAT Hey Alistair,
The thread I was actually referring to was definitely deleted, it was posted by a close friend who is one of the most knowledgeable multi DAW users I have encountered in many a year. His post simply outlined the issues he had encountered , some work arounds , etc. It was deleted without warning.
The first thread I linked to was moved and I relinked, it has now either been moved again or its deleted as well. According to the poster here who went off 1/2 cocked, its also been deleted. | I believe this is the one, right? http://www.steinberg.net/forum/viewt...?f=179&t=30446
Hence me wondering if the other one wasn't just moved too. There are a couple of threads about issues with the eLicenser. It isn't like they are hiding the problem or anything. It would be weird removing some threads but not others as everyone can still see that the eLicenser upgrade was broken. But who knows... Maybe it was an overzealous moderator... Quote:
The idiocy in deleted that thread was the issues being reported at the time were 100% valid, Steinberg had released C7 onto the market with a significant issue with the latest eLicenser ( not the one initially installed , an updated but still broken version ). The fix was posted 1 week later.
Not to mention one of the demos was created in "7.01" and is totally inoperable in 7.0 unless several of the plugins are disabled , so who exactly is BETA and QA this rollout is my question ? !!
| Duh! Having for once been patient and not gotten the upgrade directly I am finding the chaos of this release a little comical.  But I understand the frustration of the people that have paid for the upgrade. Quote: |
There has been a flood of issues being reported simply because they have rushed it to market and have not crossed the t's and dotted the i's. Again the end users are finding issue in a few minutes that was totally missed by BETA / Q.A, it just isn't good enough IMO.
| This is really bad management IMO. After building up their reputation with a couple of solid releases they throw all those efforts away in a greedy attempt to cash in on the Xmas shopping spree. *shakes head* That is IMO what happens when you let the marketing department do anything besides market what has been developed by the "real" departments... 
Alistair
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Alistair Johnston - TV & Film Post, Mastering, Sound Design
--
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself -- and you are the easiest person to fool" -- Richard P. Feynman
"There's a sucker born every minute" -- P.T. Barnum
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13th December 2012
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#33 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: Melbourne : Australia :
Posts: 1,222
Thread Starter | Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderTow | Yeh thats the original one, I had already relinked to it after the first move and it broke again.
I'll fix the link in my post again.
Thanks.
The thread I was referring to about being deleted was not moved, it was definitely deleted. Quote: |
This is really bad management IMO. After building up their reputation with a couple of solid releases they throw all those efforts away in a greedy attempt to cash in on the Xmas shopping spree. *shakes head* That is IMO what happens when you let the marketing department do anything besides market what has been developed by the "real" departments... | But the "real" i.e BETA/QA departments missed basic fundamental things like eLicenser version compatibility, and even working demos that were created in a later version than was available and corrupted, its not all the marketing department. | |
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14th December 2012
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#34 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: the Netherlands
Posts: 5,037
| Quote:
Originally Posted by TAFKAT But the "real" i.e BETA/QA departments missed basic fundamental things like eLicenser version compatibility, and even working demos that were created in a later version than was available and corrupted, its not all the marketing department. | True but I doubt the engineering department set the pre Xmas release date... Anyway, in the end it doesn't matter. We deal with SB as a whole, not just individual departments.
Alistair
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16th December 2012
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#35 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 640
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Wanted to put in a good word for ASIO guard.
Has worked great on my system. A heavy duty project that I had to run at 512 samples latency on Cubase 6.5 is glitch free at 96 samples now.
js
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16th December 2012
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#36 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 647
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I just stuck Cubase 7 on my ageing iMac 10.6.8 to try it out and I am getting a very good low latency performance using ASIO Guard, first time I've felt Cubase feels truly cross platform.
Can't wait to install it on my main PC workstation.
I'd consider a new Mac Pro for Cubase now.
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17th December 2012
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#37 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Dec 2009 Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 2,055
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Sounds like 7.5 is gonna be one awesome update...
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18th December 2012
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#38 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: Melbourne : Australia :
Posts: 1,222
Thread Starter |
Quick heads up ,
While I am still trying to come up for air , a member at DAWbench has run up some quick numbers on both DSP and VI on Windows , with DSP at 032/128 resulted in a 4-7% improvement in the number of plugins , obviously no change with VI as Kontakt is not supported, but it was manually activated for the testing ( disabled by default ). Not even sure if added hooks are under bonnet to disallow punters bypassing the default disabled setting.
Looks like I was wrong about the 4x hardware buffer , well at least on Windows. Lets see where the dust settles on OSX. | |
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18th December 2012
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#39 | | Gear interested
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 22
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That's encouraging, thanks for the update!
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5th April 2013
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#40 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Jun 2007 Location: Zurich
Posts: 1,189
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So what's your ASIO Guard experience after some months?
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7th April 2013
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#41 | | Gear nut
Joined: Apr 2011 Location: Moscow
Posts: 119
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Does the ASIO guard work on Mac? Everywhere they say it has been developed for Windows.
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7th April 2013
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#42 | | Gear maniac
Joined: Aug 2007 Location: Spain
Posts: 291
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It does work in Mac
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7th April 2013
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#43 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: Melbourne : Australia :
Posts: 1,222
Thread Starter | | |
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8th April 2013
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#44 | | Gear maniac
Joined: Aug 2007 Location: Spain
Posts: 291
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In my system, it does perform better than in 6.5
Cubase 7 is still quite buggy, though
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17th April 2013
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#45 | | Gear nut
Joined: Mar 2007 Location: Sweden
Posts: 146
| Quote:
Originally Posted by TAFKAT | You are linking to a thread that confirms serious C7 problems on both OSX and Windows. Steinberg admits they have a problem and say they are working on a solution. They focus on OSX first - maybe OSX users have been more vocal...
Seems like C7 is still in beta.
Steinberg should retire ASIO and make a modern audio engine.
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17th April 2013
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#46 | | Gear nut
Joined: Apr 2011 Location: Moscow
Posts: 119
| Quote:
Originally Posted by kalle789 You are linking to a thread that confirms serious C7 problems on both OSX and Windows. Steinberg admits they have a problem and say they are working on a solution. They focus on OSX first - maybe OSX users have been more vocal...
Seems like C7 is still in beta.
Steinberg should retire ASIO and make a modern audio engine. | Definitely C7 is a raw product for Mac. But with good signs of perspective.
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17th April 2013
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#47 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: the Netherlands
Posts: 5,037
| Quote:
Originally Posted by kalle789 Steinberg should retire ASIO and make a modern audio engine. | Doesn't Cubase use CoreAudio on Macs? ASIO works absolutely fine in Windows. The problem (and many DAW and other developers have confirmed this) is OS-X.
Alistair
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17th April 2013
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#48 | | Gear nut
Joined: Mar 2007 Location: Sweden
Posts: 146
| Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderTow Doesn't Cubase use CoreAudio on Macs? ASIO works absolutely fine in Windows. The problem (and many DAW and other developers have confirmed this) is OS-X.
Alistair | No - Cubase uses ASIO on OSX. The problem confirmed in the thread TAFKAT linked to is cross platform and indicates a serious problem in Cubase´ audio engine.
The new ProTools 11 has a new native Core Audio engine. Avid claim performance is highly improved. We'll see if they matched Logic...
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17th April 2013
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#49 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: the Netherlands
Posts: 5,037
| Quote:
Originally Posted by kalle789 No - Cubase uses ASIO on OSX. | Fair enough. That still doesn't mean that ASIO is to blame in general. Quote: |
The problem confirmed in the thread TAFKAT linked to is cross platform and indicates a serious problem in Cubase´ audio engine.
| I've demoed C7 recently and it was giving me issues (Not load issues. Other weird stuff) and some crucial stuff has been removed. So for me at the moment: No go. Quote: |
The new ProTools 11 has a new native Core Audio engine. Avid claim performance is highly improved. We'll see if they matched Logic...
| I'm really looking forward to seeing how PT11 performs!
Alistair
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17th April 2013
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#50 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: Melbourne : Australia :
Posts: 1,222
Thread Starter | Quote:
Originally Posted by kalle789 No - Cubase uses ASIO on OSX. The problem confirmed in the thread TAFKAT linked to is cross platform and indicates a serious problem in Cubase´ audio engine.. | 
Cubase does not use ASIO for OSX , we have been going around in circles over this urban myth for years and I have clarified it numerous times already.
StudioOne, Reaper, Ableton all have similar performance variables cross platform, do you seriously think seriously all of them are using ASIO, or is there another variable ?
The performance variable is more to do with OSX and Core Audio's inherent lack of efficiency at low latencies.
The problems with C7 on OSX is due to the Hybrid Engine not gelling as well as hoped IMO.
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17th April 2013
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#51 | | Gear nut
Joined: Mar 2007 Location: Sweden
Posts: 146
| Quote:
Originally Posted by TAFKAT
Cubase does not use ASIO for OSX , we have been going around in circles over this urban myth for years and I have clarified it numerous times already.
StudioOne, Reaper, Ableton all have similar performance variables cross platform, do you seriously think seriously all of them are using ASIO, or is there another variable ?
The performance variable is more to do with OSX and Core Audio's inherent lack of efficiency at low latencies.
The problems with C7 on OSX is due to the Hybrid Engine not gelling as well as hoped IMO. |
It was you who posted the "define working" link....
Might be that the ASIO is driver, as Steinberg call it on OSX, is not the same as ASIO on Windows. But that doesn't change my point.
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18th April 2013
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#52 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Mar 2006 Location: Melbourne : Australia :
Posts: 1,222
Thread Starter |
I must have missed the point you were trying to make past your irrelevant ASIO rant.
I posted a link defining that there are still issues with Cubendo performance on OSX, that has absolutely nothing to do with "ASIO" !!!
Re they should make a modern audio engine, like who exactly ?
The Steinberg audio engine is BAIOS , which then arbitrates with the respective driver protocol of ASIO or Core Audio , it is more advanced than most , in fact most others are still playing catch up.
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18th April 2013
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#53 | | Gear nut
Joined: Mar 2007 Location: Sweden
Posts: 146
| Quote:
Originally Posted by TAFKAT I must have missed the point you were trying to make past your irrelevant ASIO rant.
I posted a link defining that there are still issues with Cubendo performance on OSX, that has absolutely nothing to do with "ASIO" !!!
Re they should make a modern audio engine, like who exactly ?
The Steinberg audio engine is BAIOS , which then arbitrates with the respective driver protocol of ASIO or Core Audio , it is more advanced than most , in fact most others are still playing catch up. | You should read the thread you linked to. Oh well...
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