Mixing position frequency graph

[bkg73]

Hey Bruce,

Do you happen to have a frequency response graph of your old Attack wall mixing enviroment that you can share with us?

If not can you recall how flat it was or what charecteristics it had?

After watching your video a year ago I decided to make my own attack wall.
I couldn't afford the ASC tues so I made them myself.
They seem to work pretty well and I have never heard such a clear,
precise image.

THANKS!!!

Brandon

[Bruce Swedien]

Originally Posted by bkg73

Hey Bruce,

Do you happen to have a frequency response graph of your old Attack wall mixing enviroment that you can share with us?

If not can you recall how flat it was or what charecteristics it had?

After watching your video a year ago I decided to make my own attack wall.
I couldn't afford the ASC tues so I made them myself.
They seem to work pretty well and I have never heard such a clear,
precise image.

THANKS!!!

Brandon

Brandon.....

Use your ears!!!!

Bruce Swedien

[bkg73]

I do...
But the way I understand the mechanics of the mixing enviroment is
that very early reflections can trick the ear.
I believe it to be true since before I had the homemade attack wall
I had a less than stellar mixing enviroment and I could never get
the bass level correct in my mixes because of the room modes etc.. they made me
think there was too much bass when actually there was not enough.
My mixes always came out bassless or just the opposite.
I took many CD burns and listening to it on home stereos etc.. to tweak
the mixes in.
Happily, now with the attak wall that is no longer a problem.
What I am hearing thru my monitors is what I hear on the first burned CD.

Anyway, just curious how the freq response of the real deal ASC traps
compare to what I have manufactured.

Thanks,
Brandon

[Martin Kantola]

Attached you'll see the absorption curve for round tube traps of different sizes (from the ASC website).

A simple frequency response graph would not tell you anything, and should not be confused with the room response; decay or reverberation curve. Maybe that's what you were asking about?

You could measure a ruler flat frequency response at yout mixing response and at the same time the bass in your room might have a reverberation time of 3 seconds... Very boomy in other words...

Also, the issue of early reflections is another thing again. There are many books that explain all of this better than I ever could.

Anyway, looking at the ASC graph you can see how it absorbs the lower while actually reflecting the higher frequencies. This is very useful for shaping the decay in a typical room, since it really helps to balance the decay curve.



Martin

[Bruce Swedien]

Originally Posted by Martin Kantola

Attached you'll see the absorption curve for round tube traps of different sizes (from the ASC website).

A simple frequency response graph would not tell you anything, and should not be confused with the room response; decay or reverberation curve. Maybe that's what you were asking about?

You could measure a ruler flat frequency response at yout mixing response and at the same time the bass in your room might have a reverberation time of 3 seconds... Very boomy in other words...

Also, the issue of early reflections is another thing again. There are many books that explain all of this better than I ever could.

Anyway, looking at the ASC graph you can see how it absorbs the lower while actually reflecting the higher frequencies. This is very useful for shaping the decay in a typical room, since it really helps to balance the decay curve.



Martin

Martin......

You and I have worked many hours in my control room (inside my Attack
Wall).... Tell the folks here what you hear and how it affects the product!!!

Bruce Swedien

[bkg73]

Thank You Martin.
I understand what you are saying.
I have not measured the decay time of my mixing room yet.
I will have to do that, thank you for bringing that up.
I know there is a db level at which reverberation is considered non destructive
in the mix position. I will have to look that up again.
I manufactured my tube traps with 1/2 of the cylinder reflective
just like the ASC traps.
So I getting that beneficial diffusion effect around the outside boundaries of my
attack wall / mixing room.
The room is decent size I don't know...30' x 14' there bouts with vaulted ceiling.
It has wood floors and is not a perfect rectangle.
When in my mixing position I do not notice excessive reverb decay, but it will be interesting to measure it and modify it if need be.

Thx
Brandon

[Martin Kantola]

Bruce,

I'd be more than happy to share some thoughts on my Attack Wall Experience.

My first impression and something I always listen for is the (phantom) center mono image between the speakers. Tells me a lot about the accuracy of the system, both spectral and temporal... (sorry if I'm inventing new words here...)

There's no doubt that the Attack Wall played a major role.

In your studio, the center image was razor sharp and very stable. Incredible, considering that there's a whole console and other gear around. I have never heard such accuracy in a studio before. For the first time, the huge importance of careful panning in a mix became obvious to me!

As for stereo images (real and surreal), I think I even said something like "what's the idea with 5.1, I'm already surrounded in 360 degrees!)

It was honestly also the first time I instantly felt right at home with the frequency balance. Apart from being able to trust the overall frequency spectrum (so that the mixes never give you nasty surprises when played on other systems) I felt it also enabled a very creative and accurate use of EQ. Moving sideways from the center mixing position (to another channel or so) didn't alter the sound as much as it usually does (which can be a very frustrating thing).

The amount of applied reverbs and delays can be difficult to judge if there's smearing from the room reflections. With the Attack Wall the results were never too dry or wet, just right. This is important, since too much absorbtion would create a very misleading and unnatural soundfield.

Most importantly, listening to the Music was always a joy in that environment, and ear fatigue was never around the corner. I've later listened to the mixes even in some very high-end systems and they always sound just right!



Martin

[Martin Kantola]

Bruce,

I'd be more than happy to share some thoughts on my Attack Wall Experience.

My first impression and something I always listen for is the (phantom) center mono image between the speakers. Tells me a lot about the accuracy of the system, both spectral and temporal... (sorry if I'm inventing new words here...)

There's no doubt that the Attack Wall played a major role.

In your studio, the center image was razor sharp and very stable. Incredible, considering that there's a whole console and other gear around. I have never heard such accuracy in a studio before. For the first time, the huge importance of careful panning in a mix became obvious to me!

As for stereo images (real and surreal), I think I even said something like "what's the idea with 5.1, I'm already surrounded in 360 degrees!)

It was honestly also the first time I instantly felt right at home with the frequency balance. Apart from being able to trust the overall frequency spectrum (so that the mixes never give you nasty surprises when played on other systems) I felt it also enabled a very creative and accurate use of EQ. Moving sideways from the center mixing position (to another channel or so) didn't alter the sound as much as it usually does (which can be a very frustrating thing).

The amount of applied reverbs and delays can be difficult to judge if there's smearing from the room reflections. With the Attack Wall the results were never too dry or wet, just right. This is important, since too much absorbtion would create a very misleading and unnatural soundfield.

Most importantly, listening to the Music was always a joy in that environment, and ear fatigue was never around the corner. I've later listened to the mixes even in some very high-end systems and they always sound just right!



Martin