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Sound n'Safe for Absorption
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543diditwork
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12th August 2012
Old 12th August 2012
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Sound n'Safe for Absorption

I will start by saying that I have gone through a number of threads on this forum as well as a few other websites in regards to sound aborption panels. I went to my local hardware store, home depot, to find insulation and wood for the panels. They had some furring strips that were 2 inches think, which of course end up measuring a bit short of that. For insulation, the only kind they had in batts were Roxul Sound n'Safe, and perhaps another Roxul product.
The problem with these products is that I was looking to make 2 inch deep panels, Sound n'Safe is 3 inches. Also, they seemed to have no ability to hold they're shape, which is of course what the panels are for, but because the insulation will extend past the furring strips, whether its 2" or 3" thick, I'm afraid it will push against the fabric and give a lumpy appearance. I would like this to be aesthetically pleasing too. (This site has pictures that show this situation, but his panels seem to have a relatively flat face - How to Build Your Own Acoustic Panels (DIY) | AcousticsFREQ.com )
I was wondering if anyone could tell me if a lumpy appearance from 2" and/or 3" thick insulation will happen because of the insulation extending past the frame. Or, if anyone knows of an insulation that won't cause such a problem. I do prefer to just pick up locally, but will order if need be. And the cheaper the better (within reason of course). Any help in this matter is greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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13th August 2012
Old 13th August 2012
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Whereis local? Other than your being in the USA, we know nothing of were to direct you. Go to HVAC suppliers and ask for 4-6 lb/ft³ fiberglass or 6-8 lb/ft³ mineral wool. Either at 2" thick is good.

Andre
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13th August 2012
Old 13th August 2012
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Hi, I'm new to this forum and just came across your post while researching bass traps. I just made 4 wall panels with this exact material (Roxul Safe n' Sound 3" thick). I made the panels out of 1"x4" with 2 horizontal braces in the back. This gives just enough spacing for the insulation to be even with the front of the panels. No bunching or lumps and it looks way better than expected. I covered 2 panels with fabric and the other 2 panels with burlap (for aesthetics-needed to keep the wife happy). So far the performance has been wonderful and now my room is treated and still looks awesome. Nice sharp lines and even look. I'm going to try to attach a photo...

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14th August 2012
Old 14th August 2012
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cmcblues

How did you end up hanging the traps on the wall?
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14th August 2012
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Hi Dozer, I used the flush-mount wall clips sold at ATS acoustics Acoustic Panels by ATS Acoustics. Their directions say to use 3 but I only used 2 on the horizontal braces on the back and it worked perfectly. And they look great. They also sell corner clips of the same type for mounting traps in the corners but I'm not doing that with mine for now. They'll just be free standing.
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14th August 2012
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543-I would also like to add I'm currently in the process of making bass traps and making this same decision (flush with edge or having the fabric push insulation in). I should finish my traps this week and then I can tell you for sure. I might also mention that I will be using burlap (same brown stuff on my wall panels in the pic) and it is fairly coarse texture so any lumpiness that may be present might not show nearly as bad as another type of covering.
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14th August 2012
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Where did you bought your fabric? Also how much did it cost? Thanks!
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14th August 2012
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I forget how much yardage it was but I think total for all 4 panels was less than $50. I also bought some thin, breathable white (cheap) fabric for the back that I stapled on first. Then the insulation went through the front and lastly the cover fabric. All told, I think it was $200 or so for all 4 panels. That includes the wood, screws, and right angle brackets for the frames.

I lucked out when I bought the Safe n' Sound. Lowe's considers it a special order item when you order it online. I purchased it for in-store pickup and they botched my order. They never placed the special order when they received my online order so it too twice as long to get. I made them give me one of the packages for free. I bought 2 packs of the 3" 2x4 batts. Each pack has 8 (total of 16 batts). I planned on treating my closet with panels too but the room sounds pretty good for recording so I'm just going to make some isolation panels instead.
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14th August 2012
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Sorry I forgot to mention I bought my fabric at Joann Fabrics.
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15th August 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmcblues View Post
Hi Dozer, I used the flush-mount wall clips sold at ATS acoustics Acoustic Panels by ATS Acoustics. Their directions say to use 3 but I only used 2 on the horizontal braces on the back and it worked perfectly. And they look great. They also sell corner clips of the same type for mounting traps in the corners but I'm not doing that with mine for now. They'll just be free standing.
Found them,,,panels look great!!
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#11
15th August 2012
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Thanks for your answer cmcblues. I just want to know, but does it smells? (Roxul Safe n' Sound) because I find that this mineral wool smells a lot in the plastic.
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15th August 2012
Old 15th August 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golitan11 View Post
Thanks for your answer cmcblues. I just want to know, but does it smells? (Roxul Safe n' Sound) because I find that this mineral wool smells a lot in the plastic.
Insulation commonly has a smell that comes with it. It is typically from the bonding agent used in the process. Opening up the bags and leaving them outside for a few days will air it out fine.
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15th August 2012
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Thanks kasmira!
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15th August 2012
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+1 on the smell but leaving mine in the garage a few days really helped with that. I'm very sensitive to smells and I really don't even notice a smell. Good luck.
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15th August 2012
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cmcblues,

Those panels look awesome. I bought 2 bundles of Safe'n'Sound yesterday (from Anawalt Lumber, Beverly Hills, for anyone interested in a distributer in the LA area). I've seen other pictures of DIY panels using the same materials as yours, but yours look so sharp and pro. How did you get the burlap/fabric so nicely around the frame? It sounds like a trivial/silly question, but others' panels look too bulky and thrown together, not nearly as clean as yours. What's your trick? Could you take a picture of the top or side of the panel? I'm curious to see what you did with the overlapping burlap/fabric, if there was any.

-- Thanks
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15th August 2012
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cmcblues,

I'm looking to make bass traps as well. How are you making those/what supplies are you using? I'd love to see pictures when you're done -- I'll post my panels/traps as well when completed. Finally, where did you purchase the burlap (I saw you got the fabric from Joann).

Appreciate it.
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15th August 2012
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Mpitluk-

Thanks for the kind words about the panels. I did everything very methodically because I wanted it to look good. I can post pics later today of the corners so you can see them. I also have some pics of the covering process. The bass traps will be covered this week and I can document that more while I do it. I got the fabric and burlap both at Joann's on sale.
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15th August 2012
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Yeah, more pics....when you get time..great sleek look.
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16th August 2012
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https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/...305_n.jpg?dl=1

https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/...971_n.jpg?dl=1

https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/...238_n.jpg?dl=1

https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/...293_n.jpg?dl=1

https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/...290_n.jpg?dl=1

https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/...926_n.jpg?dl=1

https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/...014_n.jpg?dl=1

https://fbcdn-photos-a.akamaihd.net/...305_n.jpg?dl=1

These pics detail the wall panels (the frames with 2 horizontal braces in the middle). It also shows the thin fabric for the back as well as the front fabric stretched out and ironed before mounting to the frame. The wood frame provides the sharp lines and when you attach the fabric staple the middle of one long side first and then stretch it firm and attach in the middle of the opposite long side. Then finish off those ends with staples and then do the same thing with the two other ends. That's when you do the corners. I folded it over once and stapled it then folded over again and stapled. That's where the small corner fold came from. The other wood frame in the photos is one of the two bass traps I'm working on. Let me know if you have more questions.
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16th August 2012
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16th August 2012
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16th August 2012
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Yeah the white is for the back. It was to make sure the insulation was sealed in fabric. It's just a cheap white cloth. Anything will do as long as its breathable.
543diditwork
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16th August 2012
Old 16th August 2012
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I'm from Long Island, NY. Though when I said I would prefer to stay local, I meant to imply that pick-up (aka at the home depot by me) is prefered over shipping.

My main issue is that the absorption material will extend past the frame, and I want to know which materials will not cause bumps and bunching against the fabric, or if this will be a problem at all.
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16th August 2012
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Sorry 543, I did not intend to hijack your post. I will be able to give you a full answer in a few days.
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16th August 2012
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Freaking awesome!!
Going to be doing mine the same way.
However, I will be either cutting holes along tops and sides with
either a router, or series of holes with a hole-saw.

Would be putting fabric on the inside of panel frame, to cover holes.
Could do some 2 tone panels that way...sides one color, and front a different
color.

Once I start the project, I will be posting progress pics also.
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16th August 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmcblues View Post
Sorry 543, I did not intend to hijack your post. I will be able to give you a full answer in a few days.
I don't think he will see it that way.
You have shown an alternate method.
This will prevent the corners from being "lumpy".
Although it does not use the cheaper method of furring strips.

In the OP's linked example of the panel build, they are using Roxul RHT 80, which I believe is more
sturdy and firm than safe'n'sound. Which would give cleaner corners.
Though I am sure a nice panel can be made regardless, if you take your time on your folds
and use your eye to judge equal tightness around the edges.
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16th August 2012
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A small investment in higher quality wood makes a HUGE difference in the quality of the frame. Just a few extra bucks can mean the difference between something looking cheap or something that's inexpensive and looks good. I learned the hard way by making frames from cheaper wood and only realizing after that the wood was cheap and splits too easy to hold the wall clips as well as all the staples needed for the backing and covering.
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16th August 2012
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cmcblues,

Great pictures. Very helpful and much appreciated.

Do you recommend a certain kind of wood? You sound knowledgeable here.

Also, to be sure, you purchased the Safe'n'Sound batts (non-rigid) panels, right? If so, did you use an (spray?) adhesive to keep the wool attached to the horizontal beams on the back of the frame/on the inside sides of the frame?

Thanks again.
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16th August 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpitluk View Post
cmcblues,

Great pictures. Very helpful and much appreciated.

Do you recommend a certain kind of wood? You sound knowledgeable here.

Also, to be sure, you purchased the Safe'n'Sound batts (non-rigid) panels, right? If so, did you use an (spray?) adhesive to keep the wool attached to the horizontal beams on the back of the frame/on the inside sides of the frame?

Thanks again.
Hey mpitluk, you're very welcome for all the pics and stuff. That's why I took them so I could offer it as a resource (and to show off to my brother-another home studio DIY-er!).

Yes, I bought the non-rigid Safe 'n' Sound insulation batts (3" deep, 23" wide and 47" long). And I did not use a spray adhesive although after reading what everyone is saying about drooping of insulation, I probably could've done that and it could possibly prevent it. But I've had these panels up for a couple months with zero issues currently.

I made the dimensions of the frame so there was no gap around the edge of the insulation. It fit pretty snug in there so I doubt it'll droop anytime soon, if ever. As far as the wood goes, I didn't buy anything too expensive, but it was probably a step or two above the cheapest wood you can get. I started out buying the cheapest and after building 3 frames, decided the wood was not quality enough. I wanted these to look good. So I went back to Home Depot (in Spring, TX) and bought some nicer wood. I think it's just standard whitewood (found it on homedepot.com). You will have to do some searching to find wood that is straight and not bent or warped. And just make sure the side you use for the front edge is smooth and doesn't have any knots. I'm sure you could dump more money into this, but why bother? Get the best wood you can afford; it's gonna get covered anyway. Btw, I used the same wood for the horizontal braces as I did for the outside frame. Just buy a couple extra boards to cut up for the braces.

I will be finishing my bass traps probably by this weekend. I will be using 2 batts in each trap (same Roxul stuff) as opposed to just 1 batt in each panel I made. The frames are just shallow enough to where both batts won't fit flush like the panels did so I may have to make sure they are compressed firmly into the frame to keep from being lumpy. This stuff compresses fairly easily, it seems. I can show some other detailed pics of the covering process to help you get a clean, snug fit around the frame. If you have someone to help you, utilize them. They can hold the fabric tight while you staple it down. Go in small sections at a time. My wife actually helped me with this (and I'd be remiss if I didn't mention her...); she had some good ideas about how to keep everything tight and clean. With the burlap or any other more porous material, the sharp corners of the frames may snag it a bit and tear it if you pull too hard. Just be wary of this. You could even sand down the edges of the frame to give it a smoother look (which is what I felt like I should've done after I saw the finished product but now I'm used to the sharp lines and look). Lastly, regardless of the material you use, make sure you iron it out on a mild steam and heat setting to get rid of any creases or lines. And yes, you can iron burlap. I ironed my material on the carpet on my floor (don't do it over your hardwood!). You don't want to go through all this trouble of making great frames only to cover it with wrinkly material. That's like going to a job interview in a shirt that spent the last week on the floor; it just won't get you anywhere.
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#30
17th August 2012
Old 17th August 2012
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cmcblues,

Thanks for all the great information there. I didn't think of sanding down the wood or ironing the burlap/fabric. But, indeed, these go a long way in making the panels look pro -- as evidenced by your pics.

Anyway, I am going to start building some panels this weekend -- probably eight to start. Then, like you, I'm going to double up the wool for bass traps. However, I was thinking about cutting the wool batts in half and making 24" x 24" x 6" traps that fit nicely in the tri-corners of the room.

I'll take pics. Have fun over the weekend, I know I will ...
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