Vaulted Ceiling Studio Project | Acoustic Treatments

[Paje]

Greetings all,

I thought I'd start a thread for my little studio acoustic treatment project. I've composed a quick SketchUp of the room (attached).

I have enough material on order to construct 60 4" thick 24"x48" bass traps (OC-703). Obviously I won't need all those in this room but I'll be able to use them elsewhere in my (crazy contemporary architecture) home.

So I've got a pretty good idea of where I'll be placing the bass traps around the room; corners from floor to ceiling, reflection points along the walls, etc.,. I'll add those to the SketchUp next. I'm a little less certain on where to place along the ceiling. I was thinking a trio (or even four?) centered directly above the mixing-point (@ 38% from wall, about 9'4" in my room's case) for starters. Any other "cloud" recommendations? And, what about diffusers?

Since I am a solo/"do-it-all" operation, ideally this room will perform for everything; tracking, mixing, control. I have my reservations on being able to record well (50' mic cables, etc., on hand jic) but it would be "quieter" acoustic instruments (no drums) - mostly acoustic guitars, hammered dulcimer, vox, cello, violin, etc.,. so I am hopeful.

Any tips on trap (&, if applicable, diffuser) placement as well as ideal (if any) location within the room for recording would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers,
Paje

[Tomer1]

Why just 4`, go thicker where possible space wise.

[Glenn Kuras]

Originally Posted by Tomer1

Why just 4`, go thicker where possible space wise.

Totally agree. If you have that much treatment make the bass traps 6" or fill the corners, then make 2" panels for early reflection points.

Glenn

[Paje]

Originally Posted by Glenn Kuras

Totally agree. If you have that much treatment make the bass traps 6" or fill the corners, then make 2" panels for early reflection points.

Glenn

Thanks kindly for the replies.

I had thought to make at least a few 6" traps actually (forgot to post that this thread). If it is preferable/advisable to make more, I'll definitely do it. Changing all the bass traps to 6" is feasible.

Now I just have to determine how best to address those vaulted ceilings.

Cheers,
Paje


ETA ~> I think I'll likely treat the top/beam, of the vaulted ceiling like a big corner & do 6 bass traps (3 on each side). Attached is the working SketchUp (just imagine each side mirrored on opposite)

[johndykstra]

I'm assuming tha by "mirroring" you are including the back ceiling vault and back wall as well yes?

Having said that, I would make the back wall corner traps thicker, super chunks even.

On the side walls towards the back wher you have 3 traps, you may want to consider two traps per wall, with them staggered across from each other. Meaning if the left wall starts with a trap, than the right wall starts blank, and repeat. It appears as though you will be tracking back there, and you may not want it to get too dead. Those blank wall spots, along with some space on the back wall, would be a good place to think about diffusion.

Also, be careful to not have a strip of untreated wall surface running around the perimeter of the room near the floor. You may want to make the traps a bit taller, to avoid too many bare parellel surfaces.

Looks great by the way, have fun in there!

edit: also consider moving your mix position back a bit, and maybe soffit mounting your monitors.

[Weasel9992]

Sounds like you have a pretty good idea of what you need to do. Just make sure you trap the heck out of that ceiling peak. You'll also need to do something with the down sloping gable behind you; that could get ugly if you leave it bare. You could go with absorption or diffusion there, actually. Hit all the corners, back wall and front wall...then shoot the room and see where you are.

Have fun!

Frank

[Paje]

Thanks for the replies Gents.

dykstraster@gmai ~> yes indeed, by "mirroring" I meant that I would repeat the pattern I did in the SketchUp on the opposite, corresponding sides - including that ceiling peak (so it will have 6 total traps across it totalling 24' long and 8' wide of trap matl). I was just doing that for simplicity. I just downloaded that SketchUp software yesterday... a bit tricky orienting and placing components yet.

Good suggestion on the back wall, doing two (as opposed to three) traps and staggering. You're right, I probably don't want it too dead. Diffusers may be just the ticket.

On the mix/desk/monitoring locale & set-up ~ that is also a bit simplified in SketchUp. I just grabbed some gear that someone had already designed and shared. Reality is more complex (isn't it always?, lol). I've got the 38% distance from the wall marked and accounted for though - in order to leave maxiumum space available for all my instruments, etc., - I do have to slide my chair back from my desk (~ 2') to be at the precise location. Here's an actual photo:


That also shows how I presently have some of my instruments arranged. Also something I will have to move/remedy. Honestly, I'd like to leave them there, and may even try some diffusion behind and between, but I suspect that will be a non-starter if any "sympathy" (harmonic resonance) notes start to enter the mix (again, I'm only recording acoustic, low volume in here, if I do it at all - still may have to create a recording room in another locale).

On the continuous, untreated lower perimeter - perhaps I should put some traps along there as well, oriented as 4' wide? I'll add some to my next SketchUp to best illustrate.

Thanks for the kind words! I am having fun already! (even though it is work, it's a labour of love to be sure).

Weasel9992 ~> Thanks Frank! Your avatar looks like Dave Weckl a bit. Do you think the peak treatment I've proposed would be sufficient? On the back slope/gable, I was considering to do it same as the front. I know, I'm not very imaginative, lol! That may be a good starting point though. Diffusion may be better there as well, depending on how dead/live the room becomes. I should shoot the room now too, just to make note of how horrible it is (& mark progress). I've yet to do the research on the appropriate software/analyzer(s) for that (will do soon).

Thanks again!

Cheers,
Paje

[Weasel9992]

Yeah, that looks good man. And by the way, what a beautiful room...those guitars are KILLER, too. How many of them are custom?

Frank

[Paje]

Originally Posted by Weasel9992

Yeah, that looks good man. And by the way, what a beautiful room...those guitars are KILLER, too. How many of them are custom?

Frank

Thanks Frank! Only two from that pic are custom builds actually. Time for gear porn? lol - Here's my String Section:


Only one missing from that shot is the Batson acoustic (top right in the previous image, the one with the sinker redwood top and no soundboard-hole).

Cheers,
Paje

Ps. added latest SketchUp - extra traps on low perimeter, one removed from back wall and replaced with diffusers.

[Glenn Kuras]

is that a 12 string bass??????????????

[Paje]

Originally Posted by Glenn Kuras

is that a 12 string bass??????????????

Warr guitar 12-string Artist series ~> 6 string bass (inverted) & 6 string guitar in "stereo" (Bartolini pick-ups, 2 separate outs) touch-style instrument. Neck thru design is a 7-piece laminate of maple, wenge and paduak - wings (& overlays) are zebrawood. Think of it as carpaltunnel syndrome on a stick.

[Glenn Kuras]

Originally Posted by Paje

Warr guitar 12-string Artist series ~> 6 string bass (inverted) & 6 string guitar in "stereo" (Bartolini pick-ups, 2 separate outs) touch-style instrument. Neck thru design is a 7-piece laminate of maple, wenge and paduak - wings (& overlays) are zebrawood. Think of it as carpaltunnel syndrome on a stick.

That thing must be CRAZY to play.

BTW totally impressed. My fender looks like it was dragged down the road behind a tour van. Oh wait IT WAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Glenn

[Weasel9992]

Wow. Just...wow.

Frank

[Paje]

Originally Posted by Glenn Kuras

That thing must be CRAZY to play.

BTW totally impressed. My fender looks like it was dragged down the road behind a tour van. Oh wait IT WAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Glenn

It's a handful Glenn. Fun though & I get great tones out of it. I'll upload/link some tracks soon. Meantime, Trey Gunn is a good example of Warr Guitar technique ~> YouTube - Trey Gunn Band - Dziban Live
Thanks for the kind words on the gear. Dragged down the road or not, it's function (sound) over form (looks) that's important eh? Please extend my regards to your associate Bryan whom has been very helpful in e-mail correspondence (regarding my acoustic treatment project).

Whatsamatta Frank? (j/k)

Oh, back on topic, another thought about the room. I'm thinking I might be able to keep my guitars hanging there after all if this solution works: putting some diffuser material behind them and hang them backwards when necessary. I wanted to have some foam behind them anyways - to prevent any accidental guitar to wall contact (ouch!) &, with them turned strings to wall, the foam would (or should) dampen the strings as they rest against the foam. Thoughts?

[Glenn Kuras]

Please extend my regards to your associate Bryan whom has been very helpful in e-mail correspondence (regarding my acoustic treatment project).

Will do!

[Glenn Kuras]

Just found this one of you. Holy CRAP, you guys are awesome!! Do you guys tour?

YouTube - The Trey Gunn Band - Kuma (Live)

[Weasel9992]

Ohhhhh...so THAT'S what all those other strings are for...

Frank

P.S.: I now realize that I suck at playing guitar. I'm switching to accordion.

Frank

[johndykstra]

Originally Posted by Glenn Kuras

Just found this one of you. Holy CRAP, you guys are awesome!! Do you guys tour?

YouTube - The Trey Gunn Band - Kuma (Live)

I quit...everything.

[Paje]

Originally Posted by Glenn Kuras

Just found this one of you. Holy CRAP, you guys are awesome!! Do you guys tour?

YouTube - The Trey Gunn Band - Kuma (Live)

"You guys" - hey, that's not ME!! LOL! That's Trey Gunn (& band). They did tour. I saw them quite a few times actually (mostly in SF Bay area). No longer though, I'm sad to report. Trey also toured with King Crimson (a while ago). That was quite enjoyable to see as well... he & Tony Levin mixing it up. If you like those (youtube) tunes check out Trey's "The Joy of Molybdenum" CD (for starters).

[Glenn Kuras]

Originally Posted by Paje

"You guys" - hey, that's not ME!! LOL! That's Trey Gunn (& band). They did tour. I saw them quite a few times actually (mostly in SF Bay area). No longer though, I'm sad to report. Trey also toured with King Crimson (a while ago). That was quite enjoyable to see as well... he & Tony Levin mixing it up. If you like those (youtube) tunes check out Trey's "The Joy of Molybdenum" CD (for starters).

Oh now I see. Needless to say that guy is crazy on that thing.

[orpheus69]

Trey Gunn is a fantastic musician, saw him with David Sylvian and Robert Fripp a few times.... Unbelievable

[Paje]

Originally Posted by orpheus69

Trey Gunn is a fantastic musician, saw him with David Sylvian and Robert Fripp a few times.... Unbelievable

"League of Gentlemen"?

Back on topic ~> Here's how I've got the room planned thus far (see two attachments - I left one wall empty for visibility). 40 traps. Overkill? I'm thinking 6" thick traps in all corners and along top beam of vault.
&, yes - it's currently the master bedroom as well. I don't believe there would be any adverse acoustical effects from a bed (right? maybe even makes a good bass trap!), though I might just move it - replace it with a couch if need be. It's a personal space - so acoustics are my only concern (+ I can work until I pass out & don't have far to fall, lol!).

Cheers,
Paje

[Weasel9992]

Originally Posted by Paje

"League of Gentlemen"?

Back on topic ~> Here's how I've got the room planned thus far (see two attachments - I left one wall empty for visibility). 40 traps. Overkill? I'm thinking 6" thick traps in all corners and along top beam of vault.
&, yes - it's currently the master bedroom as well. I don't believe there would be any adverse acoustical effects from a bed (right? maybe even makes a good bass trap!), though I might just move it - replace it with a couch if need be. It's a personal space - so acoustics are my only concern (+ I can work until I pass out & don't have far to fall, lol!).

Cheers,
Paje

That won't be overkill. I don't know that you'll need any more, but it won't be overkill.

Frank

[Paje]

Originally Posted by Weasel9992

That won't be overkill. I don't know that you'll need any more, but it won't be overkill.
Frank

What about 40 6" super-bass traps? Would that be overkill? Because overkill is what I want! j/k I do have 120 pieces of OC-703 & 40 6" bags on order. I'll likely only do 14 fully filled (3 panels) 6" traps (8 in the corners & 6 along the ceiling peak) and will do an internal 2" frame on the other traps. So there'll be two 2" OC-703 panels sandwiching ~2" of "air" on those ones. I'll have to do some research/reading on the pros/cons of having "dead-air" space between layers of OC-703. I decided on doing all 6" mostly just to standardize on the size - give me the most flexibility on layout without another material spec worry. The only config I'll likely not do with the 6" bags is the 2" thick trap.

Ps. Are you sure you're not a phenomenal drummer?
vs

[Glenn Kuras]

Frank is much better looking.

[Glenn Kuras]

Now that I look again, Frank you need one of those mullets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Paje]

Just checking back in to see how the mullet is progressing. j/k!!

Actually - thought I'd update the thread with the studio status ~> complete! Well, 99%... still have to get this huge ladder out of here and do some audio analysis but, fairly much set.

Here's a couple of pics (not happy with the lighting, but they do show at least one part of the studio). I ended up consolidating on the 4" thick traps. Locations and layout went close to as planned. I decided to subtract about 4 panels and ended up with 36.





Thanks again to the forum members for all the assistance. I'll update this thread with more info/results, even some tracks perhaps, as I move forward.

Cheers,
Paje

[Weasel9992]

Dude...I completely missed the whole mullet scene. I had one when I was 19 or so. They were cool back then, I swear.

That's a great looking room man.

Frank

[Stephanc]

I had a mullet in the eighties and also have the same type of room 45' angled slope in the front and rear I mostly have it figured out but will need to rent a ladder or something to mount panels or drop a cloud from the 17' ceiling

[Paje]

Thx Frank ~> I'll be back with performance reviews. The sound struck me as "tight" compared to the reflections (& probably standing waves, etc.,) prior.

Stephan Carrol ~> I used an "orchard" (tripod) ladder here. A little bulky/cumbersome indoors (also a no-go on hardwoods ~ I've carpet here, for now) but it worked great. Not very expensive either if you had to buy something. It was a good investment for my situation as I'll also be putting it to use around the yard (have a few fruit trees, pruning, etc.,) and for catching the occasional honeybee swarm (beekeeper).

Cheers,
Paje