Wanting to build a home studio - recommendations.

[overturfa]

Hi guys,

I'm Looking to put together my own home recording studio to do everything from pre to post production mastering for my band and my own solo recording projects. The last time my band went to a studio, it made me sick the ammount of money we spent for a good recording.

I think I could do better... I already know I have a good ear for it, but I basically know nothing when I comes to studio gear.

I'm wanting to start my studio small with the basics and expand it from there and maybe eventually do some work for hire. I'm thinking of going the DAW route since computers have become so fast and so much can be done with software these days. What I need to know is what makes a good setup that will get me that near-pro sound?

I've got a somewhat decent budget to work with, but I don't want to get carried away so it's the "Low End Theory" for me...

What equipment would you guys recommend (or not recommend) to get me started? I'm talking the PC, the Software package, a DAW Controller, Mics, Pre-amps, (MOTU Interface??) useful signal processors, basically everything I would need to get me on my feet with this.

Thanks Everyone!
Adam

[Tyrone]

Hi Adam.

First question what is your budget?

Second question how many inputs do you require?

I love Pro Tools it has been a god send for me but using LE you have to use specific Digidesign interfaces. and if M-powered you have to use M-audio. If you are a using a PC obviously logic or Digital Performer isn't an option so I would go with some form of basic pro tools situation. It is good because it is an excellent piece of software and an industry standard.

[jdier]

without knowing your budget, type of music, and requirements for simultanous ins, it is hard to answer. But, you are lucky that I am an internet monkey and have little more to do than type.

Your deal sounds like mine. Last studio project ran about $8,000 for a 12 song CD for my rock and roll 4 piece. So, I decided I could build a studio for about the same. Well, It is 3 years later, my project is not done and I have spent over $8,000.

Good news? Well I have had a blast, met some cool people here, learned a lot, and have what I would consider a good set up now.

Here is what I would suggest toyou:

FF800 interface. I have had 3 interfaces now and this is the one I like the best. I like the driver stability and reliability and I like the expandability. I can plug all of my outboard preamps and compressors into it and all is good. This unit will give you 4 preamped inputs, meaning you can plug in 4 mics straight away and start recording. If you need more, you can get 4 outboard preamps and line them in. If you still need more you can grab an Octamic D for an additional 8 preamps via light pipe (or any other lightpipe enabled preamp package.) That will give you a total of 16. You should be on your way.

I would not get a mixer. Why? I am not sure. I never had one, so I did not miss not having one. I record clean signals (maybe a bit of compression here and there) with plenty of headroom and then do my EQ and effects in the box (or in the computer.)

I would recommend you get a nice computer and try out a program called Reaper. It is very inexpensive and very powerful. It also comes with a pile of free effects... I mixed all the songs on this album in reaper using just their free effects: CDNOW

You will need mics. I am a big fan of dynamics. If I had to start over I would first read this again: http://www.itrstudio.com/MIC_CHAT.PDF then I would buy 3-4 SM57's, 1 SM7, 2 Senn 421, 1 AKG 414, 1 AKG D112, and a pair of overheads. I have the Oktava 012's but I might do some more research this time and see if there was something else I liked more. I have em, they work, so I do not think about it too much any more.

I would work with the built in preamps for a while before buying any outboards but I would pick up some compressors. Personally I like the FMR RNC... might get two, and the RNLA might get one or two.

Something often overlooked... Room treatment. I would spend a night reading all of this: Build a Better Bass Trap then I would do what he told you to do. It may sound wierd, but those treatments I built are part of what has kept me sane this last few years. It really makes a difference.

Then you need monitors... I am not good with monitors. I buy used NS-10's and use them with some old bookself JBL's and some Bose 301's... results have been good, so I stick with them

headphone amp, cables, racks, mic stands, homemade gobos, to foam or not to foam (not)...

The thing that will ultimately make the biggest difference in your recording is your mic placement, room, and source (... can you sing or do you sound like a wounded dog... guitar intonation? decent amps?....)

Do not fool yourself. It will likely not be cheap, but if you head in with the right attitude and you ask smart questions on boards like this (meaning, use the search feature before you post "what is the best vocal mic for under $200?) you can have fun.

One final piece of advise: never trust anything some anonymous internet monkey tells you in a public forum... especially if they are from Wisconsin.

Lator!

[redddog]

Great stuff Jim.

[warhead]

Adam, how many simultaneous tracks do you need to record at a time?

How many tracks total do you need to work with during mixdown?

What kind of room, size, and how does it sound in there?

What style of music?

What mics do you own (maybe some 57's, etc)?

It can be done for not much dough.

War

[8th_note]

I've put together a decent recording setup for a modest cost so here's what's worked for me.....

I think you would be best off to go with one of the lower cost DAW programs to start with. I use n-Track Studio and I love it. It has automatic plugin delay compensation (absolutely necessary IMO), accepts VST and DX plugins, and has about every other feature you will ever need. You can download the full version for free (it beeps at you occasionally) and costs $75 to register. n-Track and Reaper are two excellent options and both have a number of advantages over Pro Tools LE.

I use M-Audio Delta 1010 and Delta 66 sound cards for a total of 12 channels. They have worked great for me and I like the fact that they are PCI cards which have a little lower latency than Firewire. I've taken the route of going with converters that don't have built-in preamps which has given me a little more flexibility in that area.

It was interesting to read jdier's post because his overall approach has been similar to mine but with some significant differences. I have a mixer which has given me quite a bit of flexibility in several areas. It's a Mackie 1642 VLZ - no great shakes - but it gave me 10 channels of preamps to start out with (I've since bought several outboard pres), it allows me to use a talkback mic as well as have a scratch guitar playing without taking up a recording channel, and it serves as a control for my monitor system. I run the tape outs from the mixer into the AUX input on the amp which gives me a separate volume control for the monitors on the mixing board. I never accidentally blast the monitors at high volume and I can equalize the volume between my mix and a reference CD (see below). The mixer also supplies the headphone output to the multichannel headphone amp for tracking.

Speaking of monitors, I use Polk bookshelf consumer speakers because I listened to a bunch of "recording monitors" and I like the sound of the Polks better. They are very detailed and my mixes translate very well. I use them in conjunction with a Mirage subwoofer which gives me a full range system. I use an Onkyo integrated amp to power the speakers. Another advantage to this system is that I have a CD player hooked up to the amp also which makes it easy to occasionally check my mix against a reference CD. I've found this practice invaluable in mixing.

In the microphone department, the main thing I can say is don't be afraid to go cheap. You can get an MXL 2001 for about $60 and it's a great mic for several applications (acoustic guitar and bass cab for example). Here's a few cheap mics that have worked well for me; AT MB2K (snare & guitar cab), AT Pro37R (toms, overheads, instruments), Groove Tubes GT55 (vocals, acoustic guitar), MXL 603s (acoustic guitar, overheads), and Audix D6 (kick). The more dynamic mics I have collected the less I like the sound of the good 'ole 57. I still use it as one mic of a double tracked guitar cab (the other I use is an AT 29HE - night and day different sound than the 57) but I don't use them for much else anymore.

You'll need headphones. Vic Firth Isolation headphones sound like ass but they isolate well and they are fine for tracking ($60). Sennheiser HD280's sound very good and isolate reasonably well ($100). Audio-Technica ATHM40 headphones sound very nice and nearly always get picked for vocals by the singer after trying three or four types on hand.

Last but not least, you might want to get a couple of channels of outboard preamp for vocals and general tracking. The one I would recommend to start with is the ART MPA Gold. This preamp sounds way better than it's price would indicate and you can geek out and upgrade the tubes for a different flavor. Over time I acquired enough channels of preamp that I don't use the Mackie pres anymore but I wouldn't sweat the preamps at first. If you go with a half way decent mixer or converter that has built-in pres then you'll be fine for quite a while.

If you want to hear a few things I've done you can check them out on Myspace - Mudshark Studios

[uncle duncan]

The number of simultaneous inputs you need will dictate your interface. I like the Motu stuff on a Mac, with Digital Performer. Their interfaces give you zero latency monitoring of inputs, and DP gives you automatic delay compensation for plugins. PTLE doesn't. PTLE is the worst possible choice for a DAW. But many people buy it for the PT name. Or for compatibility with other studios, which doesn't sound like it's going to be a factor with your setup.
But back to interfaces, most non-PTLE interfaces do give you zero latency monitoring of inputs, so it's not like you're limited to Motu.
One option to consider would be a Alesis HD24 hard disk recorder for tracking, a Yamaha 01V96 digital mixer for monitoring all 24 tracks via adat lightpipe, plus you could use the 12 built-in mic preamps going directly into the back of the HD24, using the inserts. This doesn't affect the individual channels on the mixer. You still have 32 channels. The pres on the 01V96 are decent. (Phantom power in groups of 4.)
Then you could get a motu 2408 interface, which has 24 channels of adat i/o, with one bank switchable to analog, and transfer tracks from the HD24 into the Mac for automation and mixing, using the 01v96 faders, eq, dynamics, and doing your volume automation of individual tracks in the Mac. (The 01v96 can only do automation via a computer sequencer, but it does have 99 scene recall, so you can revisit your mixes later, after each individual band member tells you he wants his instrument louder than everyone elses.)
The nice thing about the mixer is, when you're tracking, you can set up 4 seperate headphone mixes, (zero latency) and you don't need to fiddle around with a mouse to tweak those mixes. Personally, I think doing everything with a mouse is about the most difficult way to work, which is why so many companies make control surfaces for computer DAW's. But those control surfaces cost almost as much as the 01V96, so why waste your money?
This set up would cost, roughly:
HD24XR (XR has better convertors) - $2000?
Yamaha 01V96 - $2000 (add 16 channels of adat i/o - I don't remember $)
Motu 2408 with DP - $1400
Mac - $1000 (a two year-old dual G5 can run 48 tracks in DP without batting an eye.)
For this price, you could probably get a used PTHD setup, (minus the mixer, Mac, and HD24) but working with the HD24 is so easy, it's worth it just for workflow issues. It's just like having a 24 track machine, but you're recording onto a hard disk instead of tape. Plus, while your computer is on the fritz, or not on the fritz, but busy burning CD's or printing CD covers or whatever, you can still record.)
You'd still need some mics, and a headphone amp, but I think you'd come in under $8K. If you're more of a minimilist and don't need all the inputs on the HD24, or the mixer, you could just get the motu stuff, (one with built-in preamps, maybe) but be prepared to spend a lot of time with a mouse in your hand. And don't forget to back up your work to an external hard drive. (The HD24 comes with 2 drive bays, one for recording, one for more recording or backup. The first thing I do when I finish a session is backup to the second hard drive. And they're cheap, like $60 - $90.)
Forgot about monitors - Tascam VL-X5 - $300 a pair, I think.

[Darm]

If you have an ability to pay for a studio- its better to go and record in the studio, not wasting time and money on building your own.
You will have to spend way too much time and money to get it done. You could be making music at that time...

[jdier]

8th note,

Great post. I was hoping someone would give a clear mixer approach as the ying to my yang. Although, when all is said and done, I think I would rather play with my yang.

[8th_note]

I think I would rather play with my yang.

Too much information, dude.

[Stevil]