Gearslutz.com - View Single Post - 2 ch listening room, aiming for best possible.

terry j · 19th July 2009

Hi all

I am aware that this forum is mainly into 'pro' stuff, studios etc. But hey, acoustics is acoustics right? and so I hope you don't mind me taking a slight tangent and asking for your help with my listening room.

Maybe it will be a nice diversion from the usual??

I have lots of questions, mainly about diffusion (once you 'master' the basic concept of absorption, it's pretty well covered really...as much as you can, as thick as you can type stuff. Was I close?? ha ha).

You can't help too much if I don't give data, so for starters here is a sketch of the plan of my room.

It seems large to me as a listening room (ie I compare it to most peoples room) but maybe it is small in terms of diffusion etc etc??

The ceiling height is 4850, which is very close to the 4760 'width' of the room. Have not bothered with a mode calculator, but every measurement I have done has a big hump somewhere between 90-110 hz, so feel confident a mode calculator would spit that back at me.

The rectangles ( for eg in the bay area) are windows that are 3180 high, so no treatment possible there.

Hopefully I can load that sketch into paint and draw circles etc to show where the speakers and lp are located.

I have only just recently finished my speaker build, and now on to treatments. It is something I have 'always known' was important, so just as a quick experiment I opened a few bags of f/glass and threw them around in the room, including the old 'un-opened bag of f/glass in the corners' trick.

Raw batts, not even covered yet!! That is to the wall behind the speakers, basically behind me it is untreated at the moment. I just started and got bored at one stage, so not planned in any way but I guess I have atm LEDE.

My impressions?? Very favorable indeed. The room is well over 100 years old, and the walls are two foot thick solid brick. You can imagine the (what I presume to be) slap echo. I have been in this room for five years or so, and hung rugs on the wall to at least get rid of some of that (can just make it out on the left in the last pic). Still, plenty of bare wall left yeah!

So last weeks experiment really made a positive difference, and the funny thing is that each time I added some, I (possibly imagined) could hear where more needed to go.

Downside, even tho only half the room is done it is bordering on too dead for me. For sure, it's (obviously) fine when music is playing, but too much like a carpet showroom otherwise (when they have carpet hanging everywhere etc)

So, diffusion has strongly entered into my thinking as a result of that. Hey, even if I kept it as LEDE, am I not supposed to have diffusion behind me??

So whatever the case, I'm investigating diffusion.

Part of the enjoyment I get from diy is the 'how to do' side of it, and enjoy working out easier ways of doing things.

I have quite a few ideas in that regard, which I hope will be of interest to some of you when I get to the building, think of it as my exchange for your help!!

For example, I have a technique (to be tested tho) where I reckon I could knock up half a dozen diffusors on a saturday of any diffusor shape similar to this

GIK Acoustics: GIK D1 Diffusor

Note, I am not advocating industrial espionage here!! But, do any of you know of a shape along these lines that is known to work well as a diffusor?? If so, could you please post a link or cross section for me? Ie it is already in the public domain, intellectual property theft does not appeal to me.

This sketch appeared in another thread in this forum

presumably that was just a mock up to illustrate an idea. Such a simple shape like that you'd just bend a bit pf ply really, rather than my 'new idea', but if it had a bit more curve complexity etc then my idea could be very suitable for quick production.

So if you know of any such shapes I'd like to know too, thanks.

That is enough for a first post, hope I did not bore you all to tears, and hope that it would be an interesting side track for you all to give advice on something other that a studio.

Pending confirmation that it is OK to post a strictly 2 ch listening room thread on this forum, I guess I should ask a question or two.

Ok, what is the philosophy behind all this? That prob sounds like a dumb question, but what I'm getting at is this. If I came on and said 'I want LEDE room and here are the speaker locations and lp', then that would dictate whatever advice was to follow yeah?

An alternative approach is 'This is my bare room, I can put the speakers etc anywhere', well then we just 'treat the room' and make the room as good a performer as we can.

Did that make sense?? Ie, just because (by accident) I have something approaching an LEDE set up (and it is quite good from such a slapdash effort) does not necessarily mean I am wedded to it. Even from an aesthetic viewpoint an LEDE approach will be an 'unbalanced' look. A big part of my problem is getting the looks right in this historic and unique house (and as I hinted at earlier, that is part of the appeal in making it all work, fixing the aesthetic problems and being effective at the same time).

And, maybe I'm alone in this, absorption (tho effective) also looks pretty dull!!

So, diffusion and absorption and aesthetics, are you able to help??

Will start to ask some of the more 'technical' questions soon, this was a simple way of introducing myself and saying 'hi'.

Hi!!

19th July 2009	#1
terry j Gear maniac Joined: Jul 2009 Posts: 296 Thread Starter	2 ch listening room, aiming for best possible. Hi all I am aware that this forum is mainly into 'pro' stuff, studios etc. But hey, acoustics is acoustics right? and so I hope you don't mind me taking a slight tangent and asking for your help with my listening room. Maybe it will be a nice diversion from the usual?? I have lots of questions, mainly about diffusion (once you 'master' the basic concept of absorption, it's pretty well covered really...as much as you can, as thick as you can type stuff. Was I close?? ha ha). You can't help too much if I don't give data, so for starters here is a sketch of the plan of my room. It seems large to me as a listening room (ie I compare it to most peoples room) but maybe it is small in terms of diffusion etc etc?? The ceiling height is 4850, which is very close to the 4760 'width' of the room. Have not bothered with a mode calculator, but every measurement I have done has a big hump somewhere between 90-110 hz, so feel confident a mode calculator would spit that back at me. The rectangles ( for eg in the bay area) are windows that are 3180 high, so no treatment possible there. Hopefully I can load that sketch into paint and draw circles etc to show where the speakers and lp are located. I have only just recently finished my speaker build, and now on to treatments. It is something I have 'always known' was important, so just as a quick experiment I opened a few bags of f/glass and threw them around in the room, including the old 'un-opened bag of f/glass in the corners' trick. Raw batts, not even covered yet!! That is to the wall behind the speakers, basically behind me it is untreated at the moment. I just started and got bored at one stage, so not planned in any way but I guess I have atm LEDE. My impressions?? Very favorable indeed. The room is well over 100 years old, and the walls are two foot thick solid brick. You can imagine the (what I presume to be) slap echo. I have been in this room for five years or so, and hung rugs on the wall to at least get rid of some of that (can just make it out on the left in the last pic). Still, plenty of bare wall left yeah! So last weeks experiment really made a positive difference, and the funny thing is that each time I added some, I (possibly imagined) could hear where more needed to go. Downside, even tho only half the room is done it is bordering on too dead for me. For sure, it's (obviously) fine when music is playing, but too much like a carpet showroom otherwise (when they have carpet hanging everywhere etc) So, diffusion has strongly entered into my thinking as a result of that. Hey, even if I kept it as LEDE, am I not supposed to have diffusion behind me?? So whatever the case, I'm investigating diffusion. Part of the enjoyment I get from diy is the 'how to do' side of it, and enjoy working out easier ways of doing things. I have quite a few ideas in that regard, which I hope will be of interest to some of you when I get to the building, think of it as my exchange for your help!! For example, I have a technique (to be tested tho) where I reckon I could knock up half a dozen diffusors on a saturday of any diffusor shape similar to this GIK Acoustics: GIK D1 Diffusor Note, I am not advocating industrial espionage here!! But, do any of you know of a shape along these lines that is known to work well as a diffusor?? If so, could you please post a link or cross section for me? Ie it is already in the public domain, intellectual property theft does not appeal to me. This sketch appeared in another thread in this forum presumably that was just a mock up to illustrate an idea. Such a simple shape like that you'd just bend a bit pf ply really, rather than my 'new idea', but if it had a bit more curve complexity etc then my idea could be very suitable for quick production. So if you know of any such shapes I'd like to know too, thanks. That is enough for a first post, hope I did not bore you all to tears, and hope that it would be an interesting side track for you all to give advice on something other that a studio. Pending confirmation that it is OK to post a strictly 2 ch listening room thread on this forum, I guess I should ask a question or two. Ok, what is the philosophy behind all this? That prob sounds like a dumb question, but what I'm getting at is this. If I came on and said 'I want LEDE room and here are the speaker locations and lp', then that would dictate whatever advice was to follow yeah? An alternative approach is 'This is my bare room, I can put the speakers etc anywhere', well then we just 'treat the room' and make the room as good a performer as we can. Did that make sense?? Ie, just because (by accident) I have something approaching an LEDE set up (and it is quite good from such a slapdash effort) does not necessarily mean I am wedded to it. Even from an aesthetic viewpoint an LEDE approach will be an 'unbalanced' look. A big part of my problem is getting the looks right in this historic and unique house (and as I hinted at earlier, that is part of the appeal in making it all work, fixing the aesthetic problems and being effective at the same time). And, maybe I'm alone in this, absorption (tho effective) also looks pretty dull!! So, diffusion and absorption and aesthetics, are you able to help?? Will start to ask some of the more 'technical' questions soon, this was a simple way of introducing myself and saying 'hi'. Hi!!