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Bassmankr · 26th June 2009

With your revision the bathroom still won't work. You need to get a tape measure out and figure how things work in the real world and not on paper. A toilet is basically 2 feet wide by 2 1/2 feet long, at a MINIMUM from the centerline of the toilet you need 1 1/2 feet of space on each side (a 3 foot wide space JUST for the toilet). A small pedestal sink (smallest footprint) is 1 1/2 feet by 1 1/2 feet and you need a 3 square foot open area in front of it to use it. I gave you minimum bath sizes in a prior post, 5 x 5 if fixtures are together on one wall, 3 x 7 if fixtures are on oposite walls (like what I drew). As for the Iso, you are not looking at the practical side still, as in where someone in the iso would ACTUALLY be standing. You have to put a mic in front of them and that takes up space so the person would be standing in the back 1/3 of the Iso you drew. From that point half of the Live room is NOT visable. A sightline means being able to see ALL the other musos. Again if you want the Bath in the southwest corner and the Iso in the northeast corner, flip/rotate/mirror my plan, the work has already been done for you. Regarding doors and their locations, Wes is right! See how on my drawing none of the doors are right in a corner, that is so you can have acoustic treatments in those corners and still have full door swings. Regarding wall sizes, in a 24 x 24 space the best working arrangements you are going to get out of it are two 12 x 16 spaces for the Live and Control rooms. Anything smaller than that is just not worth it and you would be better off with a one room studio. EVERY inch counts in a small space so you have to make smart choices and the differences in sound attenuation that you would get from a thicker wall construction are NOT worth the floor square footage/volume of your working spaces that you would have to give up. So single stud, resilent channel construction is basically the ONLY smart choice for your space. It will work that way, give Dave Dalton a call if you have doubts. Lastly, while I can see you enjoy runing the numbers and trying out options I can tell practical building design is not your forte. It's great you are trying and learning but if you want to get this thing built soon as your posts suggests, try teaming up with a buddy who has those abilities. Construction mistakes are VERY expensive and someone with experience will end up saving you money. My last word on the bathroom LOL. You are building a home studio, as such musicians coming to use it know that they will have to use the house's existing bathrooms and it's not a big deal to them. You may not want them in your home using the bathroom and that's up to you but when you get the estimate of what it will cost to run water and sewer to the detached garage plus the concrete cutting of the existing slab to place all of that then it will dawn on you that for the cost it isn't worth it, walk into the house to use the bathroom and save the money. It's probably time to think of the practical side of things, normally with any construction it's about defining available space and budget FIRST. Then comes a prioritized wish list and design begins based on that. This thread has started from the opposite direction and shows why that process is important as you are not that much closer to your goal then when you started. Space, Budget, Priority list, then design accordingly. Frankly I'd just take my plan, eliminate the bathroom and just make that space one larger HVAC/Mechanical/Computers/Storage room. Add three pieces of glass, an outside door into the Live room, and minimize wall thicknesses. This will give you your true dimensions to work with and from that you can figure best ceiling heights. Then you would have what is needed to build out your garage. Good luck on your adventure!

26th June 2009	#165
Bassmankr Lives for gear Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,907	With your revision the bathroom still won't work. You need to get a tape measure out and figure how things work in the real world and not on paper. A toilet is basically 2 feet wide by 2 1/2 feet long, at a MINIMUM from the centerline of the toilet you need 1 1/2 feet of space on each side (a 3 foot wide space JUST for the toilet). A small pedestal sink (smallest footprint) is 1 1/2 feet by 1 1/2 feet and you need a 3 square foot open area in front of it to use it. I gave you minimum bath sizes in a prior post, 5 x 5 if fixtures are together on one wall, 3 x 7 if fixtures are on oposite walls (like what I drew). As for the Iso, you are not looking at the practical side still, as in where someone in the iso would ACTUALLY be standing. You have to put a mic in front of them and that takes up space so the person would be standing in the back 1/3 of the Iso you drew. From that point half of the Live room is NOT visable. A sightline means being able to see ALL the other musos. Again if you want the Bath in the southwest corner and the Iso in the northeast corner, flip/rotate/mirror my plan, the work has already been done for you. Regarding doors and their locations, Wes is right! See how on my drawing none of the doors are right in a corner, that is so you can have acoustic treatments in those corners and still have full door swings. Regarding wall sizes, in a 24 x 24 space the best working arrangements you are going to get out of it are two 12 x 16 spaces for the Live and Control rooms. Anything smaller than that is just not worth it and you would be better off with a one room studio. EVERY inch counts in a small space so you have to make smart choices and the differences in sound attenuation that you would get from a thicker wall construction are NOT worth the floor square footage/volume of your working spaces that you would have to give up. So single stud, resilent channel construction is basically the ONLY smart choice for your space. It will work that way, give Dave Dalton a call if you have doubts. Lastly, while I can see you enjoy runing the numbers and trying out options I can tell practical building design is not your forte. It's great you are trying and learning but if you want to get this thing built soon as your posts suggests, try teaming up with a buddy who has those abilities. Construction mistakes are VERY expensive and someone with experience will end up saving you money. My last word on the bathroom LOL. You are building a home studio, as such musicians coming to use it know that they will have to use the house's existing bathrooms and it's not a big deal to them. You may not want them in your home using the bathroom and that's up to you but when you get the estimate of what it will cost to run water and sewer to the detached garage plus the concrete cutting of the existing slab to place all of that then it will dawn on you that for the cost it isn't worth it, walk into the house to use the bathroom and save the money. It's probably time to think of the practical side of things, normally with any construction it's about defining available space and budget FIRST. Then comes a prioritized wish list and design begins based on that. This thread has started from the opposite direction and shows why that process is important as you are not that much closer to your goal then when you started. Space, Budget, Priority list, then design accordingly. Frankly I'd just take my plan, eliminate the bathroom and just make that space one larger HVAC/Mechanical/Computers/Storage room. Add three pieces of glass, an outside door into the Live room, and minimize wall thicknesses. This will give you your true dimensions to work with and from that you can figure best ceiling heights. Then you would have what is needed to build out your garage. Good luck on your adventure!